2vs2-4vs4 [OKW] Raketenwerfer 43 Anti-Tank Rocket stealth ability

#1
1 year ago

The stealth of this unit being able from vet0 gives it a huge advantage against allied player already from start until late game. It dosent help you need to stomp on them to detect them comparing to the soviets*note - COMMANDER ABILITY, counterpart that can be detected at normal range. Not to mention that it just cost 270MP and has a retreat ability if its comes in danger.

Some easy changes to make this unit more in line with the counterparts:

  1. Make it stealth from vet 1
  2. Make the cost to 320MP instead, its more in line with what it does.
  3. Or just make it detectable at NORMAL range like soviets, now u can stand on each side of a VP-point and not detect it, just stuped..

Thx

Comments

  • #2
    1 year ago
    KatitofKatitof Posts: 6,573

    Stealth is needed for this unit as it doesn't have frontal protection of other ATGs nor does it have the range.

    That stealth was also nerfed with vet1 no longer providing no penalty for moving.

    Plus, if you rush your tanks frontally without infantry support, you kind of deserve to lose something.

  • #3
    1 year ago
    mrdjjag81mrdjjag81 Posts: 231
    edited March 2018

    @Katitof said:
    Stealth is needed for this unit as it doesn't have frontal protection of other ATGs nor does it have the range.

    That stealth was also nerfed with vet1 no longer providing no penalty for moving.

    Plus, if you rush your tanks frontally without infantry support, you kind of deserve to lose something.

    Sprinting with them cloaked is also one thing that shouldnt be there from the beginning, they have too many favour for 270MP that makes up for its lesser protection and range that you cant really excuse on that. Also the rush in and getting shoot all of the sudden is'nt really the problem, the problem is that they can sneak up close without being detected, caping point/holding it where mgs guarding it. Still got 25+ procent movement speed at vet 1 so not selldom u see them sneaking up on the USA ambu and kill it. As i wrote, make the detection at normal range, not need to stomp on them.

  • #4
    1 year ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,719
    Rak shouldnt be able to move while cloaked. Its just bad design HOWEVER there is nothing wrong with ambush camo. Let it camo up but remain static. Improve projectile and range while cloaked.

    Also i have no clue how many stairs the mod team fell down last patch that gave them the briliant idea to nerf the slight range buff with vet on the squishiest, shortest range AT gun but leave creeping death as an option....
  • #5
    1 year ago

    @thedarkarmadillo
    If u want to nerf a rw.43 stealth u need to bring back OKW early panzerfaust or nerf crazily m3a1's armour and accuracy.
    Finally, all allied factions have strong doctrines with recon planes and USF have undoctrinal one. Maybe even rw43 will teach allied players not to investigate full muni into call-ins and weapon upgrades and grenades.

  • #6
    1 year ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,719

    @LetzteJunker said:
    If u want to nerf a rw.43 stealth u need to bring back OKW early panzerfaust or nerf crazily m3a1's armour and accuracy.
    Finally, all allied factions have strong doctrines with recon planes and USF have undoctrinal one. Maybe even rw43 will teach allied players not to investigate full muni into call-ins and weapon upgrades and grenades.

    m3a1 had its armour nerfed last patch or so making it easier to damage.
    also i assume you didnt read where it shouldnt be able to move while nerfed but should instead be better while camod... like, its right there in the first blurb, right at the end there
    it says:

    @thedarkarmadillo said:
    Let it camo up but remain static. Improve projectile and range while cloaked.

  • #7
    1 year ago

    @thedarkarmadillo
    Don't remember how m3a1 was nerfed in last patch and don't really believe that if it was nerfed it was nerfed enough. This thing is too low-cost and effective in early game, especially when u have radio-intercept and know about fielding rw43, when u can simply ignore m3, field another penal/conscript squad.
    Rw43 is not very effective against early game lights because of their mobility and only cloaked movement gives it a possibility to deal with both them and real "walking death" like centaur.
    Any nerf of cloak system or "rebalance" with better stats in stationary will affect crazily OKW durability, what is quiet low after second minute of the game.
    Maybe rw43s using as sneaky destroyer or extra active recon for OKW is cheesy, but it requires attention only after both UKF and soviets will be balanced properly.

  • #8
    1 year ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,719
    Its broken and needs to be fixed, not after other things, at the same time. Its cheesy as fuck amd shouldnt exist. Theres more than ambulances that it can kill and scamper away but also katyushas (85 fuel and 360mp iirc) as well as being able to be used as a recon/stealth capper. Its absurd.

    It cant be too good because its a blasted 270mp retreatable AT gun. But has to be good enough to provide fallback AT should the okw player lose their forward trucks and cant build AT armour.

    Also iirc the m3a1 wc51 and kuble (possibly bren?) Had their armour nerfed but healtg increased so that they are easier to damage with small arms but also more survivable vs AT weapons.
  • #9
    1 year ago
    VipperVipper Posts: 3,721
    edited March 2018

    @thedarkarmadillo said:
    Also iirc the m3a1 wc51 and kuble (possibly bren?) Had their armour nerfed but healtg increased so that they are easier to damage with small arms but also more survivable vs AT weapons.

    Kubel and WC51 did, the rest the for some strange reason did not:

    Kubelwagon
    The Kubelwagon has been adjusted to be more vulnerable to small-arms fire, limiting its ability to solo infantry squads in the early game through the RNG nature of armor.

    Front armor from 4.5 to 3
    Rear armour from 4.5 to 1.9
    Health from 190 to 240

    WC51 Military Truck
    The WC51 has been modified to be able to fulfill a support / transport role at a low cost by hitting the field with no combat capabilities. Furthermore, The low cost will also allow the WC51 to be repurchased late game to act as a support unit with its MG upgrade and abilities.

    Cost from 240/20 to 200
    Starts on a 60 second cooldown
    Starts unarmed; can be upgraded with a more powerful M2HB Mount for 60 munitions
    Passengers now suffer a 50% accuracy penalty when the vehicle is moving
    Health from 180 to 240
    Armor from 5.2/2.5 to 3.9/2.5
    Rotation rate from 30 to 45
    Population from 5 to 3

    WC51 Abilities:
    Mark Target

    Deploys a recon plane while target vehicles receives -25% armour and +25% received accuracy.
    Ability on global cooldown.
    Costs 40 munitions

  • #10
    1 year ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,719
    I stand corrected. Thanks @vipper very strange indeed that others where excluded
  • #11
    1 year ago

    @thedarkarmadillo написал:
    Its broken and needs to be fixed, not after other things, at the same time. Its cheesy as fuck amd shouldnt exist. Theres more than ambulances that it can kill and scamper away but also katyushas (85 fuel and 360mp iirc) as well as being able to be used as a recon/stealth capper. Its absurd.

    Here is a list of units what will become even more cheesy and overpowered after any rebalance of rw43 cloak:
    m3a1;bren/wasp carrier;AEC;USF AAHT;Centaur/Churchill;All allied TDs;T-70;SU-76;T-34/85/76 and Katyusha.
    All of those are stronger/cheaper that they must be and any of those will greatly benefit from lost puppchens cloak. If your ambulance suffer from it, let it be on base sector, ignore FRP and use major agressively, or move ur ambulance when u need it on field. This is how USF must be played and that's great that rektten can wipe out ambulance if it is not covered.
    With example of ostheers MG-42, what is meant to be built at start of the game but is useless against mobile UKF/USF infantry-section builds and soviet extra mobile t1 we see that stationary weapon systems suck at the moment, and making an rw43 more stationary-dependent will just softly wipe it out and leave OKW without any competitive AT, like Ostheers infantry now suffers from MG-42 dependence.

  • #12
    1 year ago
    SkysTheLimitSkysTheLi… Posts: 2,260

    The cloaking creep is absolute cheese, but its also the only solid feature of the unit. It really should be completely reworked to function more like a regular AT gun IMO. It might sound boring, but what we have now is only useful in a cheesy way.

    I don't see how anyone can defend the mechanic itself, independently of the units performance overall. Obviously it needs buffs if the stealth is changed, but it needs to be changed. I didn't really understand why they removed its ability to be suppressed while it can still retreat like all other infantry, but more than anything else I would force it to be immobile while camo'd or give it an aim-time penalty.

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