Soviet - New Commander Mod Official Discussion

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  • #32
    8 months ago
    VipperVipper Posts: 3,723

    glad that I could be of help.

  • #33
    8 months ago
    WAAAGH2000WAAAGH2000 Posts: 89

    Let Guards can shoot DP when they moving B)

  • #34
    8 months ago
    BlinkyBlinky Posts: 3

    I realized that for penal squad that already uses SVTs i tried to equip them with the SVT crate and for some reason the penal squad gets 6 PPsh.

  • #35
    8 months ago
    ComradComrad Posts: 122
    edited March 25

    I think that Soviet Airborne needs to change weapons paradropped (not SVT, but Bazookas) or replace DShK with Bazookas to paradropped and SVT and Bazookas.

  • #36
    8 months ago
    Dangminh25Dangminh25 Posts: 66
    edited March 26

    -the Soviet Airborn
    we can use Smoke Bombs from Werh commander, A plane drops huge smoke bombs into the designated area, blocking line of sight for a short period of time and the soviet airborn will spawn in it, also replace the Stuka with low range flight Douglas C-47 (give it huge amout of HP so it cannot easy shot down by AA)
    replace DP-28 upgrade with PPSH or just replace 2-3 of their rifle already and reduce 2 to 1 weapons slot, base on history the soviet airborn arms with light weapons so they cannot bring DP
    "To the last man" replace with "camouflage " the para will hold their fire and prone and moving slowly, the enemy can't spot them except in very close range
    -SVT drop rename it to Infantry weapons drop
    conscript and engineer will receive 3 SVT rifle, airborn guard & normal guard receive 1 DP-28, shocktroop & penal 1 Flamethrower, Partisans = 1 PTRS rifle
    -DShk MG drop
    the airborn are lack of AT weapon and greanade, so change it to 45mm gun drop

    the supplies drop can use voice line from Allied Supply Drop (Industry Tactics)

  • #37
    8 months ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    I'm joining the chorus late because, my internet connection was down all weekend.

    The Field Infirmary Medics don't appear so, no base healing is available. Players have to use Medical Crates only, not sure if this was intentional.

    SVT crates don't appear to work. Conscripts still appear to be carrying Mosin-Nagants. It looks like I'm spending 45MP to get 25MP back so, not good.

    Guards Airborne animation needs work. No parachutes (not really an issue) and the further you drop them from your base, the more out-of-sync their arrival is from the plane which is supposed to be carrying them. I have seen the troops arrive well before the plane gets there.

    Last and worst, the Rocket Strike is pitifully weak and takes too long to recharge. I have seen it score a direct hit on a Kubelwagen and only knock half its health off (in real life, even a dud would obliterate a Kubelwagen). Against a JgdPzr IV, it was about a 20% reduction of health. That is completely useless for a single-pass strike which takes 2 minutes to recharge. Increase the damage and reduce the recharge time OR make it a loiter like the US version OR get rid of this strike altogether and replace it with something that actually works.

    Soviet Airborne seems particularly weak in AT and the strike needs to be good enough to balance it. Right now, it's not.

  • #38
    8 months ago
    MartevallMartevall Posts: 108
    In my opinion soviet Rocket strafe can stay but with changed penetration and cooldown
  • #39
    7 months ago

    @PanzerFutz schrieb:

    The Field Infirmary Medics don't appear so, no base healing is available. Players have to use Medical Crates only, not sure if this was intentional.

    SVT crates don't appear to work. Conscripts still appear to be carrying Mosin-Nagants. It looks like I'm spending 45MP to get 25MP back so, not good.

    Are you sure, you used the updated mod? They fixed that it the new one.

    Aggree with the rest.

  • #40
    7 months ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    @GeneralWinter I'm using Mod 1.1 and it worked the first time I played it. Since then, I've played it 3 times and it doesn't work. I can't tell if the units which pick up the SVT's have different stats but, the models all appear to be carrying Mosin-Nagants.

    With the Field Infirmary, I don't think it's really a problem. I can't tell whether the Field Infirmary issue is deliberate or not because, the crates work so much better. Instead of spending manpower on the Infirmary, I just use the crates. They can be deployed anywhere on the map and they instantly heal any infantry/team unit in the vicinity. Who needs the Infirmary when you can do that? Even if I retreat a unit/units back to my base, I can just drop a crate there and instantly heal all of them.

    This will only become an issue if, in future, they decide to limit the crates to the sector in which the Rally Point is located or to within a limited radius around it. Then, they'll definitely need to fix the Infirmary. Honestly, I'd prefer them to leave it as it is because, as I said, the crates work much better.

  • #41
    7 months ago

    rocket strike need to be change

    make that loiter CAS (same as USF skill 240muni)

  • #42
    7 months ago
    Patrol_OmegaPatrol_Om… Posts: 300
    edited March 29

    @Andy_RE Thanks a lot for the 2.0 adjustments to the commander's abilities!. They feel so much smoother during gameplay.

    However, I found one possible bug on the new Airborne Guards Vet1 ability

    -Vet1 comes already unlocked if I'm not mistaken.

    Last but not least, since the SVT weapon take around 22 seconds to land into the battlefield, seconds on which the enemy can force your infantry to retreat making you lose your weapons. Could it be slightly reduced so the risk is lower?

    Also I'm not sure if this ability was moved to cost 2CP in-game instead of One CP as initially announced

    Thanks again for the adjustments to all the New Commanders Relic!

  • #43
    7 months ago
    Lnk003Lnk003 Posts: 418
    edited April 3

    Good: guard changes althought they are still snipers models
    Interesting skill shot attached to an unit. I would attach it to the rally point maybe because guards have smoke or/and oorah to counter mgs already w grenades not sharing cooldown. Speculating but I guess they could be unstoppable here w an anti infantry skill on top of everything else.
    Rally point is basically beacon 2.0 at this point (detect ennemies + frp + reinforce all troops + healing + no build limit)

    Fine: dskh airdropped
    Not hyped about: IL2 AT makes the commander too usf airborne like
    weapon crate: for the same reasons as before

    I wonder if the airborne identity isn't my issue here. Maybe you could lean toward the 37th guards tank division witch was a unit coming from airborne and witch became a tank one then? So you would still kinda match the survey results and then I would rather see IS2 in this commander (so it can be changed a bit like get better vet and ability) instead of il2, something else instead of the weapon crates like sov version of ost supply drops.

    Edit rally point retreat point works if build before t4 otherwise doesn't work

  • #44
    7 months ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822
    I think I'd rather see the pinning strafe and the AT strafe swapped. I think the ability to pin their opponents is too strong of a vet 1 ability but the AT strafe is niche enough to not make them over bearing but instead great support.
  • #45
    7 months ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    Thanks for fixing the Field Infirmary at the same time as limiting the drop radius of the Medical Supplies. That part of the mod now works as intended.

    The Rocket Strike is still a bit of a waste. It works well against infantry but, it is definitely NOT LETHAL to vehicles. For a doctrine which offers little else in terms of AT defense, the Rocket Strike should provide some balance but, it doesn't. It still can't even kill a Kubelwagen with a direct hit and that's just not good enough. Plus, a 2 minute cooldown for a single-pass strafe is way too long; what little damage it does will be repaired in a quarter of that time.

    The US version of this strike is devastating; this version is a mild annoyance. Why so weak? If you don't want to give players a good strike, maybe an IS-2 would be better.

  • #46
    7 months ago

    @PanzerFutz schrieb:

    For a doctrine which offers little else in terms of AT defense, the Rocket Strike should provide some balance but, it doesn't. It still can't even kill a Kubelwagen with a direct hit and that's just not good enough. Plus, a 2 minute cooldown for a single-pass strafe is way too long; what little damage it does will be repaired in a quarter of that time.

    The US version of this strike is devastating; this version is a mild annoyance. Why so weak? If you don't want to give players a good strike, maybe an IS-2 would be better.

    What do you think about Airdropped 45 mm AT, bit like in CoH 1.

  • #47
    7 months ago
    HyperBlancatHyperBlan… Posts: 29
    edited April 1

    Mighty soviet airborn guard can call il-2 strafe(60muni)

    meanwhile in Weh CAS commander : stuka AI strafe take 1 slot(60muni)

    USF Tactical support commander : P47 strafe take 1 slot(125muni)

    (removed)

  • #48
    7 months ago
    HyperBlancatHyperBlan… Posts: 29
    edited April 1

    (removed)

  • #49
    7 months ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    @HyperBlancat Now, now... no need for abuse. The commander is still in the testing phase; nothing is set in concrete yet. I agree that a strafe doesn't belong as a unit's special ability, but MG strafes aren't that good (except against blobs). To me, an airborne mine-drop would be far more interesting - something like the butterfly bombs from CoH1. Then, it would be more about area-denial, while providing some more AT options for this doctrine, and less about having direct airstrike support.

    @GeneralWinter Before they released the mod, I believed this doctrine might contain an airdropped M-42, perhaps as a package deal with the Dushka. Getting both in the one slot would make up for their individual deficiencies; having one slot for each, like in Defensive doctrine, would crowd out something else. I'd be willing to see the SVT's make way but, I believe a lot of other players would take exception to it.

    To be clear, my issue isn't with having a Rocket Strike; my issue is that it's too weak against tanks. The write-up for the strike says it is lethal to armor but, it clearly isn't if it can't even knock out a Kubelwagen. 140 damage is way too low. Damage for the strike needs to be raised to 200 HP for a direct hit. [This is about the same as a mine but less than a plane crash!] This means a Kubelwagen would be destroyed by a single hit, a 250 halftrack would lose ~85% of its health, a 251 would lose ~65%, a Luchs would lose 50%, a Pzr 4 would lose ~30% and a Panther would lose 25%.

    That's not going to kill any tanks on it's own but, it might tip the balance during a battle. It is the sort of strike this commander needs.

  • #50
    7 months ago
    Patrol_OmegaPatrol_Om… Posts: 300

    @Lnk003 The Commander is a masterpiece as it already is. Probably reducing the 22 seconds from SVTs drop down to 15 seconds > @HyperBlancat said:

    Mighty soviet airborn guard can call il-2 strafe(60muni)

    meanwhile in Weh CAS commander : stuka AI strafe take 1 slot(60muni)

    USF Tactical support commander : P47 strafe take 1 slot(125muni)

    nice commander balance, mod team

    fool

    Oh, you are talking about the Axis Air Mgs attack that can destroy tanks? While the same ability from the Soviets won't even scratch them, so what about it again?

    Ps: You should get banned for recuring to insults kiddo.

  • #51
    7 months ago

    @Patrol_Omega said:
    @Lnk003 The Commander is a masterpiece as it already is. Probably reducing the 22 seconds from SVTs drop down to 15 seconds > @HyperBlancat said:

    Mighty soviet airborn guard can call il-2 strafe(60muni)

    meanwhile in Weh CAS commander : stuka AI strafe take 1 slot(60muni)

    USF Tactical support commander : P47 strafe take 1 slot(125muni)

    nice commander balance, mod team

    fool

    Oh, you are talking about the Axis Air Mgs attack that can destroy tanks? While the same ability from the Soviets won't even scratch them, so what about it again?

    Ps: You should get banned for recuring to insults kiddo.

    i am talking about axis anti-infantry strafe not anti-tank strafe, u idiot

    yep, soviet also have same skill but not good

    that skill also need some buff or replace somthing

    And i also said USF anti-infantry strafe is too expensive(125muni)

    Learn to read

  • #52
    7 months ago

    So i just played the soviet airborne again and i decided to equip the Penals with the weapon drop and ended up getting a penal squad with 6 ppsh making them basically shock troops without armor. Did anyone else try that ?

  • #53
    7 months ago
    vsrvsr Posts: 93

    The soviet rocket strafe seemed very powerful vs that building. With the plane coming in near instantainiously, it could be used to wipe garrisoned squads rather easily, especially MGs and raketenwerfers. It probably needs a modifier so it doesn't immediatly level buildings.

  • #54
    7 months ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822

    ok so:
    bug
    -sometimes when calling in the airborne guards i also go a crate of SVTs
    -guards vet 1 strike didnt require vet

    balance
    -the "vet1" strike is bat shit OP. i was able to wipe mgs with ease by using it. yea its 60mu and on a global cool down but....damn... too strong
    -the rocket strike is inversely bad. at 100mu it failed to even 1/4 health damage to a p4 in my play tests, and ass shots on a panther were no more impressive

    my suggestions:
    -merge the SVT drop into one of the existing abilities (the FHQ perhaps?) and add a mid range ability (vehicle detection maybe?) to give a bit of a mid game bump and remind the player that they did indeed pick a commander
    -replace guards vet 1 with something more reasonable, ill admit that i dont really have a suggestion. the LMG guards would benefit from hit the dirt but ppsh guards less so.

    perhaps swapping the AT strafe (but buffing it slightly) and the AI strafe so that the guards call in the weak but cheap strafe and the AI strafe is the more expensive global?

  • #55
    7 months ago
    Sander93Sander93 Posts: 49
    edited March 30

    @thedarkarmadillo said:
    balance
    -the "vet1" strike is bat shit OP. i was able to wipe mgs with ease by using it. yea its 60mu and on a global cool down but....damn... too strong

    The damage that it does is unintentionally high. It should do next to no damage but deal a good amount of suppression. Basically it's supposed to be similar to the Suppressive Fire ability that LMG Paras and Obersoldaten get, but more thematically and a bit more powerful (for higher cost). The damage will be fixed in the next update / hotfix.

  • #56
    7 months ago
    SlayerSlayer Posts: 132
    Rename the commander to Soviet Infiltration.

    The guards are not paratroopers at all, they suddenly pop up in the middle of some smoke, a sorry excuse for a paradrop. So pls make a nice parachute animation, if that's too much work, you can always switch to Soviet Deep Battle Tactics, with the Red Banner T34/85.

    I agree on the weakness of the rocketstrike btw, pretty useless ability atm.
  • #57
    7 months ago
    Sander93Sander93 Posts: 49

    @Slayer said:
    The guards are not paratroopers at all, they suddenly pop up in the middle of some smoke, a sorry excuse for a paradrop. So pls make a nice parachute animation, if that's too much work

    I'll ignore your condescending tone because I'm sure you are grateful that the community balance team is spending their free time to bring you new free content. The team does not have access to the core of the game so it's not that easy (and might just be impossible) to slap parachutes on a squad. It will probably be changed to something more elegant if adding parachutes proves to be impossible.

  • #58
    7 months ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822
    > @Sander93 said:
    > @Slayer said:
    > The guards are not paratroopers at all, they suddenly pop up in the middle of some smoke, a sorry excuse for a paradrop. So pls make a nice parachute animation, if that's too much work
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > I'll ignore your condescending tone because I'm sure you are grateful that the community balance team is spending their free time to bring you new free content. The team does not have access to the core of the game so it's not that easy (and might just be impossible) to slap parachutes on a squad. It will probably be changed to something more elegant if adding parachutes proves to be impossible.

    In one of my play tests dropping guards also dropped the weapon crates. If attaching chutes to guards isnt possible perhaps some thing like this could be more elegant:

    Keep the smoke
    -Combine the guards drop and the SVT drops just so there is a chute we get sight of as it drops
    -Reduce guards weapons to 3 SVTs and 3 nagants.
    -Reduce mp slightly and add small muni cost to accommodate the weaker guards but flexibility of the SVTs

    This means guards now have 3 upgrade paths (or 4 maybe as unupgraded is an option)
    They can get the ppshs for free, pick up the SVTs or get the DP28s (or stay unarmed for those sweet weaponslots)

    This also opens up a slot for something else. Maybe fuel air drop? Just to kinda round out the commander.

    Also glad to hear the strafe is getting tuned... It was alarmingly powerful.
  • #59
    7 months ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    In my opinion, the biggest flaw of this doctrine is the relative weakness of the AT elements. I think I have a way to change that: attach the Airdropped Weapons to the Airborne Rally Point. This would free up a slot for an airdropped M-42 AT gun, available at 2 CP. This would give the Soviets a handy little gun just as enemy factions are bringing vehicles into the battle, complementing the Dushka nicely.

    If they do free up a slot, I wouldn't want the fuel airdrop, not until they make Soviet supply planes always enter from their base sector.

  • #60
    7 months ago
    RomanovRomanov Posts: 48

    @Lnk003 said:
    Good: guard changes althought they are still snipers models

    you do realize they intentionally use the sniper models for the airborne guards?i myself dont see why they need to be guards, but the sniper model is intentional because of the camouflage suit.

  • #61
    7 months ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822

    @PanzerFutz said:
    In my opinion, the biggest flaw of this doctrine is the relative weakness of the AT elements. I think I have a way to change that: attach the Airdropped Weapons to the Airborne Rally Point. This would free up a slot for an airdropped M-42 AT gun, available at 2 CP. This would give the Soviets a handy little gun just as enemy factions are bringing vehicles into the battle, complementing the Dushka nicely.

    If they do free up a slot, I wouldn't want the fuel airdrop, not until they make Soviet supply planes always enter from their base sector.

    could even have the DSHK and m42 both airdrop from the rally point. might need to be more than 10 fuel though and then it also really makes usf airborne a bit shitty in comparison

    also fixing the AT strafe would help the AT void in the commander

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