Balancing, Quality Changes ( that need to happen ) and everything that's currently wrong

#1
6 months ago

Hello Everyone,

Vampire Prince here... And I think it's prior time we give this, one of a kind, special RTS game with an extreme profficiency to become a new RTS with a worldwide competitive ranking, a small kicker into whats wrong and whats good

I won't be going into why* or how* this game has its potential, but Franky? I believe people who play RTS for the tactical decisions and choices that influence your game, more than APM RTS ( Yes im looking at you , Starcraft 2 ) that are all around based on who clicks faster on map...

BUT, without further adue, I think it's time we get to the point of what might be biggest issue here, and whats capable of ruining alot of games with great potential ( META is 1 of the main problems also )

For an easier kicker, I think its more than fair that I start with Quality of Gameplay Improvements, which, I think, could make game a weeee bit more interesting to strategize about :smile:

  1. MINES and MINE REMOVAL

I know that this might be a long shot, but nothing beats cleaning minefields with mortars and grenades and especially if you see an engineer placing them, so you give him a good bombing while he is about to finish it >:)
But, what if we actually used a little bit of our brain power and figured out that digging them out, literally by engineers, refunded the player who stole em, 50% of their ammo value? ( or a bit more than 50%)

50% Ammo Refund on whoever scavenges them would make them interesting enough to clear em with engineers and maybe a bit more accurate and, if we look into how it should really work out, reusable but for the enemy?

  1. **RIFLE, L/H MG, ASSAULT and SMG penetrations **

Now this might seem a bit awkward... But lately, easiest way to counter, kill and penetrate light and scout cars and vehicles is by getting an automatized squad and if they get close, DPS should be able to ruin it faster and more securely than an actual anti tank or vehicle squad
Tehnically, Bolt action rifles and L/H MG should have highest priority penetration, and SMG smallest , regardless of dps, and ASSAULT somewhere in between, if we are looking at ARMOR penetration

Also fair notice, these weapons should have different accuracy modifiers and positioning bonuses, because I can't believe that a squad of bolt fire riflemen should be forced into automatized weapons for dps increase... If you manage to keep enemy at bay your weapons should do some serious damage, regardless of the Type they are ( snipers are solid example of this ), but we can't and WE SHOULDN't make weapons instakill because that could ruin game itself...

Also included, I believe that accuracy should be defining part of units DPS*, and not that different weapons on different infantry squads dictate each weapons 1 shot damage, but thats a problem that probably will never be solved xD

  1. TANK SHELLS and USAGE

Now, I know this might be a bit weird to comprehend, but I am slightly butthurt (with a good reason )that some things just DON'T make any HISTORICAL or TECHNICAL sence... For example, I understand that full AP shells shouldn't ever EVER be used against infantry, but that coherently in this RTS genre doesn't mean that they should be regarded as shooting PLASTIC bullets at them, or being incompetent even to aim at the SINGLE model of enemy infantry*

For example, Panther shares same Cannon type as the famous Tiger tank, yet its damage vs Infantry is almost non-existant
STUGs, which were more famous for breaking enemy fortifications, their shells which are semi accurate howitzer rounds, have no damage on infantry either

I can understand this about STUG's and Russian version of Long Distance Motorized AT gun ( SU ), if their general purpose is to snipe tanks of long distance, but Cruisers and Medium tanks?

Disconcerning Sherman Firefly ( who also had explosive shells ) and Jackson who was re-purposed open top AT TANK, these tanks are quite unfulfilling of their duties , aside from providing the LINEAR usage that explains their purpose

That is, unless you are RUSSIAN... then It really doesn't matter because you have nothing to worry about xD
T34 -76 is A DAMN cheap Russian mid tier cruiser tank with great utility and can fend off enemy tanks easily (Spammable also)
T34 -85 Also cheap, but probably best tank in this game due to the fact it can counter infantry with its cannon, it can counter Tigers and Panthers since for some reason it can penetrate them all on front, and ontop of all that, it has quite a bouncing armor a good health amount (also cheap, who knew?)

This is somewhat general issue , which can be solved by making these unit either limit restricted (T34 85, max 2 tanks), Actually fixed to be accurately effective vs infantry also ( even minimally, for Panthers ) and making tanks and units perform better for their pricing...

I do have to apologize, I believe I strafed off into what may seem the 2nd part of this Topic, and that might need to be general Issues with game itself....

BUUUUT, Now we are at the Main part :wink:

Instead of going all out on which are the UPs and DOWNS on every nation, I think it would be best if I kicked off this topic with a smart start of what is general issue at hand, and its Rebalancing on already irrelevant things, by nerfing ones and buffing others... Generally I am familiar that there are alot... a DAMN lot more AXIS than ALLIES players overall, but you cannot balance the game by nerfing one and buffing other, expecting people to shift sides, that will mainly just make people uninstall the game or stop playing it...

I think I am fairly allowed to say these things in post, since I have tried all nations and although I do have my prefferences, I play all of them and i play for both Axis and Allies sides

WEHRMACHT

Currently, in my opinion, the least balanced ( weakened ) and underdeveloped nation you can think off... It has its funny tactics and doings, but every other nation was balanced ON IT, and WEHRMACHT has fallen off behind massively, both on utility and usefulness

Grenadiers are the infantry who tend to die more than Conscripts due to their model dispersion and individual HP (and cost) and their usefulness is mainly based upon if they managed to wait for enemy to come to them, to get first shooting bonus

Panzergrenadiers are supposted to be a Commando typed heavy infantry of Wehrmacht, with higher price and medium-close range weaponry and specialization... Do NOT THINK of them THIS WAY...
-> Literally, Shock troops can eat them, Commandoes ignore em and even Cavalry Infantry can outduel them, since their model health is weak, their weapons lack dps buff and only good thing about them are variety of voicelines
Also they tend to die most saddening of ways due to low health... Please BUFF and FIX these units...

Stormtroopers, looking down on latest patches, have been tweaked quite ... weirdly, but share some ressemblance and issues of Panzergrenadiers , and aswell for their price and even with upgrades, they can't deal with enemy Shocks or Commandoes at ALL
->** IMPORTANT note and ALSO HIGHLY respectful for DEVELOPERS**, adjust their D and F Hotkeys to their corresponding abilities, or add more hotkeys, because when they research a Panzerwerfen their D ability for smoke becomes 30ammo missclick for vehicle scouting... Which can be grieverous if a person has to click and drop grenades manually with a mouse...

Armored Car Sdkfz 222 = This units weapon accuracy and effiency is illegally bad xD

PAK 40 = I don't know what they did with this units accuracy... but its quite depressive and completely unable to hit T70s or some regular tanks , and even penetration is a joke... I had once 2 paks shooting an enemy Pershing and 1 was flanking it, out of 7 shots, 4 bounced, 2 missed and only 1 connected :neutral:

Ostwind Flakpanzer = Generally solid tank... But has no suppression on his main weapon, making him only AA gun platform without suppression or any additional anti unit abilities ( like brits for example )

Panzer 4 and OKW Panzer 4= Now this... This is just a Disaster tank nowadays... Expensive, Dies really easily, and his accuracy is, which seems to be a new German Black Plague type of thingie, is nonexistant

IDEA : Stugs could use Smoke Shell shot on long range for utility... And Panzer IV some utility updates also

Panther and OKW Panther= Look for things upwards in discussion, also for a tank that was historically one of most accurate tanks, this one sure misses more than it should on all aspects, and provides no anti infantry potential, even with its MGs ( unlike T34 who seems to have a much greater MG accuracy )

Panzerwefen = Is quite solid... But nonewhere as near as good as Katyusha

Brummar = Can't instakill infantry even tho it shoots a shell that is as sized as a bucket :smile:

Wehrmacht Bunkers = Could use price reduction for Medics, to increase their utility and build order in early game (same for Brits)

OBERKOMMANDO WEST

Generally, a nation of High Cost units, with no fuel and ammo expansions ( need Wehrmacht help in this ) but have scavenging ability which suffices some of this dissadvantages... But generally has same disease of German Black Plague ( nonexistant tank accuracy and no accurate Armor Platings )

Volksgrenadiers = Solid infantry who can be spammed, but get countered on mid short range by more specialized infantry... Generally useful, and in my opinion, one of best balanced early tier infantry

MG 34 Team = IDK why but their stats and weapon efficiency is massively bad compared to other MG units, even brits supress better

Obersoldaten = believe me , they deal strong Single Shot damage, but there is nothing UBER* about them as it should be... Without veterancy they are highly inneficient, they tend to die to most GRUESOME deaths due to their models idea of sucking up mortars and explosive shells with dispersion, yes, they can turn into monsters with HIGH END veterancy, but again, for price, for massive duration of respawning them ( longest reinforcement time in game) and fairly small usefulness aside bundle grenade and acid smoke... Generally unit needs a rework

Raketwefen = Interesting unit... but for some reason Massively better than Pak40 , both on accuracy and penetration xD

Lucht = on a weird but solid spot rn

7.5cm le.IG 18 infantry Support gun = Now this AINT A MORTAR:... this can work as a mortar but essencially its a Support gun, made for supporting infantry... Creating smoke and barraging buildings effectively... But there is 1 thing that is a LEGENDARY NEED and DESIRE that has never been seen, but massively mentioned on both streams : GIVE this UNIT easier XP LEVELING... like Vet 5 le.IG is a thing of legend and almost never achieveable xD

Stuka zu fus ( land stuka ) artillery sdkfz 221 = Now this unit is quite dangerous long range bombardment, with good utility and straightforward purpose, but has extremely wide spread and nonewhere near as dangerous as Katyusha ( i will get to her soon)

Panther = Issue overally can be seen in Wehrmatch also... Somewhat completely innaccurately made compared to other units in this game, and extremely expensive with pricy build path, especially for a nation with no gas bonuses

Panzer 4 = look up to Wehrmacht, German Black Plague

Tiger Tank = Now this is quite interesting... Elite lategame tier unit with high armor, health ( although KV, easily accessible Churchill also have similiar health and tankiness, even better in some aspects for size) and damage vs all...
This unit also tends to have some miss issues, but can be easily swarm killed by more specialized anti tank tanks and massive blobbed infantry with AT satchels... Quite depressive tbh to withness, but good unit overall, if not for random easily penetrations by tanks who shouldn't even be able to scratch it ( upfront T34 75 for example )

Generally, Germans are suffering alot of unbalance on tanks, their tanks accuracy ( since german tanks and tankers have been famous in WW2 for their back aim, really untrained crew, unlike conscript filled t34 :smile: ) and their tanks shell usefulness...
Alongside massively lacking utility, making more than 50% of their tanks only ability to have blitzkrieg ( unit speed increase for storming enemy lines) , while other nations tanks have much more useful abilities and utilities, from capping to shells...
Alongside this, they need reworking, and price reduction / or allies tank price increase , and I would also like to state that no german player, regardless of whether its 1 v 1 or 4 v 4, almost never EVER will Blitzkrieg the enemy for this reason, since blitzkrieging in this game since last few years will only mean certain loss and destruction of your vehicles, while cheaper allied armor (USF and SOVIETS ) can afford blitzkrieging more than nation that developed this strategy ( ONE OF MAIN issues at hand)

NOW, for a Flip of a Coin, lets talk about our everyones favorite , Allied Forces and their advantages and disadvantages:

THE BRITISH FORCES

Frankly, I find Brits to be in a good spot atm, but there are some things that I would consider necessary to tweak in order to make them more Accurate and thoughtful :)

Anti Tank Rifle Infantry Section = I kinda find it shameful that they can no longer buy Medikits or Flares

Infantry Section = Quite balanced infantry, but 5 man upgrade is quite dangerous thing in my opinion and should not be only Brit thing ( Wehr should have it also ) and they fulfill their Glass Cannon role epicly, meaning, if you position them well, they can wreck enemy infantry :smile:

Piats and Brens = could use some stat updates and accuracy tweaks

Cromwell = The example of utility and Frontline tank, Unlike Panzer 4 ( has smoke shot, speed, good accuracy and scouting range )

Forward Assembly = okay, this might sound weird, but it has Recall Infantry bug , for AGES NOW
-> Also, the upgrade for medics should come in cheaper so for people who are not as fond of constantly grouping infantry or tactically advanced on healing infantry on front, to be able to recall the brits back home and have this building, like Wehrmacht or Russians ( who have it cheapest ) built in their base for healing on retreat

Sherman Firefly = Check upstairs the issue, also has some massive pathfinding problems on reformed terrain

Churchill Tank = Now this is , in my opinion, a bit too BUFFED tank for what it presents... with alot of utility... Like seriusly alot of Beefiness

Comet Tank = Could use some accuracy update and anti Infantry tweaking, Check Shells section

Commandoes = Need update to get up to date*, they haven't been tweaked in long LONG time

Bofors and Mortar emplacement = The fortifications doctorine makes counterplay vs them slightly impossible... So best option is to just go to other parts of map, if possible ( this could be tweaked by adding weakness and advantages which are better explained)

Generally , I won't go into details about other things about brits, since their gameplay tactics and ARTY opening are quite dependant on their Commander options, meaning that there can be no land matress or Artillery vehicles without appropriate choices and sacrifices, but this also makes some viable and others completely unviable...

USF FORCES

Generally, USF forces are quite spammable infantry tactics with specialized tanks lategame, which can vary in loadout and units depending on commander choices

Riflemen = General infantryman, and in my opinion, alongside Penals, probably strongest early tier units which can scale infinitely into lategame

Cavalry Riflemen = Good units, and fun to use, but slightly too hard to hit on late end veterancies and pretty much like rangers, can solo kill alot of units

Rear Echelor = Quite solid infantry squad, with bunker which allows them to shoot out grenades ( literally USF version of Wehrmacht bunker ) so its quite solid overall, can also supress

Combat Engineers (cant remember name, guys with grease guns) = they got massive buffs in latest patches which makes them even more simple to use ( i would actually say dumb to use... on my rush runs on the nation ) and for their price? Overperforming... Especially with veterancy

Generally, USF unlocks new tiers by buying the appropriate special squad units... Which is interesting game mechanic in my opinion, but these units should use some Recieved Accuracy nefs since they are almost unkillable when retreating

Sherman Series = Now this might sound a bit rigid of me... But I am not sure how Shermans should deal so easily with Panzer 4s... These tanks should be evenly matched , and at some points Shermans outmatch even panthers in direct engages... Not including Easy 8 and Later version, which are even better in these stated performances, especially for Prices all these tanks come out with.
Shermans are overally fun to use and bring spice to game, especially with their utility ( which Wehrmacht tanks are completely lacking due to no updates)

Jackson = Franky, I love this tank... But I gotta say, bonus armor pen Shot damage and fact that its on move accuracy is almost impeccable, is something that needs to be tweaked or in case it gets regarded as fine, buffed on panthers

Howitzer Motor Carriage = Now this... I don't want to be rude... This is unfair unit with accuracy, Speed and Turret rotation, and fact it can instakill , while Brummar can't, is Unfair in my books and i believe that only this Instakilling aspect should be tweaked, just for fairness of brummars nerf aswell

Also, the thing that i found extremely relaxing and weirdening on USF is the way that tank crew can repair them... I know this may sound odd but i think this repair speed should be slower than regular engineers since it doesn't occupy any of their infantrys original work around map... Or atleast a bit more tweaked
Generally, I find this one of the most amazing mechanics in the game :smiley: , to leave the tank and return in it with your own veterancies

SOVIET FORCES

And now, we finally got to our last nation, Soviets...
Small prologue... I had an indept discussion with friends and watched alot of streams, including current 4v4 tournaments that Hans is broadcasting, and franky, I can say this nation is the most unfair nation of them all, when it comes to balance...

Although I will agree with my good friend who mains them, Russians are lacking specialization for their Tank choices ( which i frankly do not see so ravenously) but their Tanks Efficiency, accuracy and usefulness is generally overcoming this downs and in turn, turning them into most forgiving, and yet most deadly effective force

Also, the thing that in my book makes Russians so simply effective is their squad sizes on everything, so they easily survive RNG moments and have much much MUCH harder to kill MG squads ( which are in turn again,... quite spammable for low unit pop cap)

But lets get started:

Conscripts = Generally, cheap infantry who can duel solidly, do not fear the losses and later veterancies make them amazing with weapons accuracy... Generally too cheap and forgiving in my opinion since i remember loosing them like flies and never really giving a damn xD

Penal Battalions = Now... I know this might sound rigid... But this units are extremely overperforming for their price, upgrades and weapons... Their scaling just lets them mow down through tiers without any obvious weaknesses and they are effectively used in every single aspect of a round

Shock Troops = Now... This might be a bit evil of me... But these units, they were shit before... And only smart and tactical people knew how to utilize them and use them...
Although I am happy about their rework... I have never been so much dissapointed in this game about how MUCH OF BUFF a unit has gotten xDDD
Like these units are sickeningly strong, utilized and can walk into enemies and just radically dismember them without worries or issues thinking their losses are expensive... Like the cancer of the game
And frankly? Community knows this and thats why they are the most spammable units nowadays

Guard Rifle Infantry = Ironically? I know they are elites and tanky units and their utility is well deserved... And franky? I like em and don't think they need any changing at all

M3A1 Scout Car = I love this unit and i love starting with this units harrass... but Shooting on Retreat accuracy is too high... Sorry but not sorry I've won too many games by just gunning down retreating Wehrmacht infantry with this xD

M5 Halftrack transport = Now, I know what you may think... What can you possibly mean is wrong with this unit etc? Tbh nothing, but I believe in Fairness of Patches and I frankly want this unit to have 50% less XP gain when it gets AA upgrade, same way Wehrmacht Flammenwerfen halftrack got a few mini patches ago, so it doesn't become instant Vet 3

T70 = This tank is literal incarnation of Ninjas in this game... Takes 3 AT shots, and its impossible to hit from evasion it has... Alongside it, its main cannon has almost 100% infantry accuracy... So yeah... Either reduce damage takes to kill it or balance it some other way...

And now, the moment that we have all been waiting for so long, the climax of Russian Supremacy:
T34 76 = Now as I've stated above... this tank is far too cheap for its accuracy, Time it comes out and generally utility ( capping ) and anti infantry and even vehicle performance
This tank is highly effective against panzer 4, unless its OKW panzer IV, which can win a 1 v 1 duel, but , by the time there is panzer IV on field by OWK, you can already have 2 or 3 of them T34's and you can suicide crash one into enemy panzer to make sure it doesn't escape
For some reason this tank can also easily penetrate and chasedown enemy panther, and even pierce tiger on front sometimes

T34 85 = The mother of Unfairness in this game, If I've ever seen one... Tank who can duel Panther, who comes out really cheap, has great mobility, great health, great accuracy and is well, GENERALLY great and Instant pick for every child who plays this game... definitely needs some nerf... I am sorry... as much as i aswell love this unit... I must say that I like diversity... And want to enforce it in RTS games

KV1 = Its okay tbh
KV2 = Frankly a bit too effective vs some tanks in my opinion
KV 8 Flame = Now this tank, if it was on german side... Would be a blitzkrieg tank, for way its played... the moment you get it you just go straight forward into enemy lines and crash into enemy infantry, AT guns and everything, since flame damage is so high it can almost melt enemy AT guns before they get to fire 2nd shot

ISU = I tehnically have nothin personal against this tank since its a Russian version of elephant, but I do have against it dealing so high damage to infantry and gun crews, which elefant, who fires High Velocity explosive rounds for some reason cannot do ( this is unfair in my opinion, since if its a massive AT GUN it should ACT as massive AT gun or get balanced )

Finally, the thing that I would most certainly make A MEME out, and has been a MEME on HANS-es streams of tournament lately:

Katyusha
By Hanses Vocabular = Oh look a Katusha whiped his squad... Ohhh another katyusha whipes that vet 3 grenadiers... Damn OKW volksgrenadiers got completely whiped on retreat and near their base, basically, if you watch this stream he gasps when an AXIS arty whipes something, but is actually quite gotten used to saying that Russian Katyusha whipes almost ALWAYS something

This is main reason which poisons this game... Katyushas are good vs everything, and yes, i respect their developed historical accuracy... But they don't need to land directly to whipe a squad, they fire a ton of rockets on varieting distance and they deal massive splash damage which can 1 shot kill vet 3 and vet 5 squads of all sizes... And lets not say they got great range and can get special ability and to top it all off, deal vehicle damage also and can whipe vehicles and buildings much more easily than ANY mobile artillery unit of this tier

I don't want to sound like a hater , but katyushas are one of thoose dummy picks which work however you turn them, and thats quite depressive, and you don't even need to aim specifically to hit like OKW variant, and aim to supress like Wehr version ( since katyusha doesn't need supression, it WHIPES em completely ) and they need as soon as possible, tuning down and damage / splash reduction... Because they are biggest arty no brainer in game right now

Alongside it, I would reduce the amount of Repair spots they can build for free tank repairs ( on industrial commander ) and medical aid tents with newer commanders on fronts, since they don't rack up pop cap and can easily be constructed and used by whole team.


This brings us to the end of this list , which can be quite nicely used to summarize the final idea of this threat and balancing issue:

Wehrmacht and OKW units (especially tanks) need some stats and Prices adjusted, Tanks mainly need accuracy and on the move hit changes since this things, are most frustrating things that can happen ( even on Hanses stream... He often can be seen commenting that AXIS AT guns and tanks miss too often and consistently, and other streamers also ), and we all know that historically AXIS tank crews were highly innacurate and untrained ( the Irony and Black Plague of Accuracy)

Wehrmacht and OKW need patching up to become more viable and variety utilized, mainly to have vehicles provide more utility than only having straightforward ability like blitzkrieg...

Russians need to have a massive toning down to enable actual brain usage and punishment for losses and provide the feeling of Need / Desire, to make every decision count toward some tactical choice and ingame investment, rather than just spam and sacrifice ( I know this might sound rough, but I played them and never EVER have I had more careless and carefree games knowing I literally don't have to worry about ANYTHING XD )

American Tanks need toning down on accuracy and some units need to have rebalancing, but this issue i find to be specific for almost all units , with exceptions of few that are new and currently META FOCUSED
The main problem are old ones

Thank you for your attention, and everyone who will contribute with your ideas and thoughts on this Post in advance, I will maintain to keeping it alive and up to date, and I want to say once more... I am not here to share hate or spite, I am here to provide ideas and things I find currently unfair and unrewarding.... And if they find themselves fixed, I believe this game could reach really highly, and with the upcoming Commander Update, I was even more invigorated to finally summarize this and write down all UPS/DOWN that need TUNING and fixing , for gameplays sake

Cheer up, round up and GAME UP, Murdering waits for noneone, so cya on Fields of Battle , Brothers and Sisters :wink:

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