OKW - Fallschrimjager New Terminator Squad - ALL

#1
6 months ago

Sept 2.0 Patch Problem:

  • Can upgrade weapons in enemy territory after getting parachuted
  • Get's such a boosted weapon for free
  • Long Rate of fire
  • Very fast Reload speed
  • Amazing burst and accuracy
  • New Terminator Squad for only 320MP || Jokes en 360MP "elite" Allied infantry

Solution:

  • No longer care, be creative

Comments

  • #2
    6 months ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 717
    edited August 2019

    I love how Fallschrim has a nerf that they're no longer drop to the ground with 4x FG42 but 2x FG42 and requires time to upgrade another 2.

    Then

    • CP3 to 2
    • Manpower price 16% cheaper
    • FG 42 Rate of fire from 6 to 7 Fire rate +16%
    • FG 42 far cooldown from 2 to 1.35 Cooldown between shot at long range +30% faster

    Yes

  • #3
    6 months ago
    ankleankle Posts: 32

    notice the balance team always throw in an OP axis unit with every patch that redefines the meta... exceedingly rare that allies get the same treatment

    of course they'll scale it back in a month or so after it goes live.. then of course do it all again next patch with another unfavour axis unit

    constant bs

  • #4
    6 months ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 717
    edited August 2019

    The problem of buff isnt actually on Ost.

    Its the Okw super cost effective infantry, every single update.
    2016 Volk gained sgt44 snare sandbag
    2018 Jeager 250mp pop out of buildings hold high resource in middle of the map endless. We saw how imba it was. To this day, the cost effective is still too great compared to Pathfinder.
    mid 2019 PzFusilier 280mp x2 Shreck
    Sep 2019 incoming Fallschrim 320mp high utility compared to PzGren 340mp


    About Fallschirm isnt that "attractive" to Okw because they have better Commander such as Heavy Fortification or Jadtiger one. Close range combat in urban they already have Sturm with flame thrower and Volk mp40 that 25% cheaper than Conscript's ppsh.

    About other close range infantry such as Para, Ranger, Shock, Commandos. Because they have no non-doc close range infantry that force players to pick the Commander to fight in urban.

    Isnt attractive doesnt mean Fallschrim is weak.

  • #5
    6 months ago
    Totally disagree @C3Tooth
    In the current state of the game is far harder to claim a Victory against the Werhmacht, rather than against the OKW.
    WER has been getting a list of heavy buffs to it's army, regardeless of how strong that unit was before the patch.
    Not to mention that none of them haven't been reblance and adjusted for an accurate price/performance variable.

    Is WER uncontested meta and with it a boring a game playing on a significant disadvantage or boring if you have free easy games playing that faction in particular.

    *MG42 suppression comes in the first bullet! Not even at the end of the first round! NO INPUT NEDDED
    *MG42 **huge** and wide range! NO INPUT NEEDEDx2

    *Rifle Grenade has a **huge** damage output! Wipping out entire squads! NO MAJOR INPUT NEEDEDx3
    Have you seen Allied infantry with such a powerfull grenade? Perhaps Elite Commandos and that's it .. not a mere cheap basic line infantry

    Axis tanks can go straight forward without caring because of the high they get. No major thinking requested

    Panzergrenadiers got both MP and Pop reduction, while getting more and more buffs paired up with 3 Intel Bulletings /fail

    And the list goes on and on
  • #6
    5 months ago
    SkazzSkazz Posts: 38

    fallshirm is still 4 man squad that get oneshotted and also looses head on with paratroop =P

  • #7
    5 months ago
    ChardChard Posts: 139

    I can't believe the amount on nonsensical whinning going on about Falls here and at that other place I care not to register for. (I have no idea why they were messed with in the first place.) I'd be happy with 3 CP falls with 4 stock FG 42s back.

    Two things I've seen posted by players:

    Increase the cost of the additional FG 42s. They now drop with 2 less 42s. The additional two now have to be purchased (after setting up the flak truck no less!). That's 60 muni per each upgraded squad. This eliminates that 60 muni from the player's pool of muni for upgrading other units, grenades and other abilities. If the upgrade cost is increased, then offset with something else. Decrease reinforcement cost, pop cap, something!

    Falls have always been able to use the Faust. This is one of the few ways a player can vet up the squad early on. Now its a problem? FOH.

    The mod team has mentioned these two:

    Valiant Assault is now in the crosshairs. WTF?! Now its an issue after all this time? If they're going to nerf some the changes to Falls AND nerf this ability I question the mod team's thought process. This will nerf the ability for the entire army. Add in some of the buffs to Allied weapon teams from the last patch and this really makes no sense. Units take more damage while this ability is active, right? If the ability is nerfed then the cost has to reflect the decrease in performance with a decrease in cost or increase the ability duration. The ability isn't cheap. The increase in muni required to upgrade the Falls has to be taken into account. Nevermind that this ability is also a way for a player to move infantry out of the way of the bevy of arty/rocket attacks that Allied armies can employ. Decrease the ability's performance and this will add a nerf in an unintended way. Reduce the sprint after a small amount of time after the ability is triggered may be a way to appease both sides. 5-10 seconds of current ability sprint modifier then it reduces speed to allow Allied weapon teams a chance to escape via retreat. Or, decrease effectiveness vs. retreating units since retreating units can't fire back.

    Increase to the squad price to 340? These guys aren't very easy to keep alive initially. If there is going to be an increase in the squad cost, there has to be a trade off. Drop the reinforcement cost or population. They were worth 380 pre-patch. Post-patch, they are about right at 320. (I don't build more than two, one if I go for an Ober.) We're heading back to the post-patch territory where they were too expensive vs. using Obers. Don't forget the increase to Volks cost. I tend to only build two now and wait for my 3rd infantry to be the Falls. Waiting any longer only puts that unit behind the vet up curve. Increase the cost of Falls and we're slowly marching back to pre-patch-Obers-are-better land. Remember, they now have to spend 60 muni to upgrade each squad. If a player fields 3-4 Falls then they'll have to spend an additional 180 - 240 muni to bring their firepower up to pre-patch levels. Plus, they won't have as much manpower or pop cap room had they only fielded 1-2.

    I can live with changes to ROF and mid range. But again, only 2 FG 42 available upon drop doesn't make these units OP. It just keeps them slightly on par for what they are facing. Players PAY for the additional 2 42s so why would they now get nerfed?

    I thought the idea was to increase the use of Falls. This unit has had enough taken from it since the introduction of OKW. The latest adjustments have been hard to swallow. At this point, as a player that tends to favor OKW and use Luft quite a lot, I tend to think I'd be better served with another commander choice or at least avoiding Falls in favor of Obers.

  • #8
    5 months ago
    SkazzSkazz Posts: 38
    Maybe there should be a counterthread discussion about chocktroopers op'ness
  • #9
    5 months ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 717

    Shock:
    360mp
    3 command point
    6men
    Weapon: x6 ppsh.
    Good at close range
    Ability: frag and smoke nade share cool down
    Deploy: from base sector
    No camoflage

    Fall:
    320mp
    2 command point
    4men
    Weapon: x2 fg / add 60 ammo for x4 fg.
    Good at all range.
    Ability: bundlenade not share cool down with smoke nade, +faust
    Deploy: from anywhere
    Can camoflage


    If you only compare the raw power between them, you dont use Fall in the right way.

  • #10
    5 months ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 717
    edited September 2019

    Scenario made up:
    A Fall walk into 4 squad of Shock, Fall retreat. A Shock walk into 4 squad of camo Fall waiting to ambush, you know the result.

    A Luch accidently run into 4 squad of Shock. It can retreat alive. A T70 accidentally run into 4 squad of Fall, T70 is dead.

    Victory point is nearly drop to 0, deploy a Shock won help. Drop Fall right only Vic point does help

    A Shock walk into MG, throw a smoke then walk back.a Fall walk into MG, throw a smoke then throw a bundle nade that deal x2 damage.


    I thought they decide to drop mp cost from 380 to 320mp with no additional ammo for x2 FG. But they does, so im not complain on Fall anymore

  • #11
    5 months ago

    @Chard if you think just because a unit is getting nerfs, it should get a price decreased, then a lot of Allied forced should cost around 40 MP less, since they have been getting nerfs since the New Commanders Patch, meanwhile Axis forces were getting buffs. However that is not the case sadly, I would love to see overly nerfed Guard Rifles cost 300 or 320 mp but I already told you ..

  • #12
    5 months ago
    ChardChard Posts: 139

    @Patrol_Omega said:
    @Chard if you think just because a unit is getting nerfs, it should get a price decreased, then a lot of Allied forced should cost around 40 MP less, since they have been getting nerfs since the New Commanders Patch, meanwhile Axis forces were getting buffs. However that is not the case sadly, I would love to see overly nerfed Guard Rifles cost 300 or 320 mp but I already told you ..

    What? I never said that. You're making stuff up.

    Also, this isn't' a discussion about other units. It is only about Falls and the Luft doctrine. Stay on topic or go cry about whatever it is you're crying about in another thread.

  • #13
    5 months ago
    I played some OKW yesterday.

    Honestly I think fallschimjager is pretty dam close to where it needs to be.
    They did get a nerf earlier in the game but with munitions and vet they scale much better later Into the game I think should be appealing to both allies and axis.

    The only added advantage they have is being able to destroy rocket trucks behinde enemy lines with faust bundle grenade and caustic smoke.

    I had a game where if the enemy didn't happen to have troops moveing past me to the front lines I could have gotten possibly all three katushas.

    Guard squads seem pretty dang sturdy in my opinion takeing on obers in another game I had and caused me to be very careful with luches as well so they seem to be ok to me not at all seemed weak.

    Only thing that I'm iffy with is 3cp paratroopers. I think they cost 140 munitions for two lmg and just slightly better than fallschimjager surviving with possibly 2 models of six that's a bit of a manpower bleed for the cost put Into them and less utility they might be better if using suppression but still you have to specifically target each squad so it is iffy.
  • #14
    5 months ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 717
    edited September 2019

    Actually 2x M1919 cost 120ammo. And Paratrooper is the only squad able to fire on the move with LMG.

    To me, 2x M1919 for Paratrooper is not really worth, and should only used if the battle is on somewhere like the North of Steppes. Otherwise, 4x Thompson is a much better choice. Give Para some deadly corner flanking, I once had a Para whip 4 Gren squads with tactical assault. The best thing about Para that they can throw grenade without disrupt 4x Thompson firepower, as 4 models shooting while the other 2 models can do something else. But thats Paratrooper, 360mp & 90ammo doing only AI role, have to be great at their job.

  • #15
    5 months ago
    @C3Tooth ok so they have somewhat cheaper lmg compaired to infantry company.
    I'm not sure about the fire on the move since you should be staying near max range other than chasing down retreating squads but it does help then.

    Thompson tactical assault seems ok I guess but I can only see this being used as an ambush tactic due to the received damage increase as long as the enemy is not quick to react and target your squad.

    But I agree you might see better results with thompsons.
  • #16
    5 months ago
    HingieHingie Posts: 1,998
    Shocks also have 1.5 armour, a relevant detail you casually omitted.
  • #17
    5 months ago
    namvnnamvn Posts: 13

    this game has serious problem, 4 Falls walk into a bar, noone left alive.

    with charge, they kill my 3 stars MG in a second, and every other inf units have to retreat in full health or face death in 2 secs. WTF?

  • #18
    5 months ago

    i watched one game where ONE vet 3 FJ slottered 3 vet 3 rifflemen squads and lost just one model self lol. To be fear, riffle didnt had weapon upgrades or blobed, but still kinda ridiculous.

  • #19
    5 months ago
    Well FJ with with upgrade and vet is almost a paratrooper equivalent.
    Though playing as okw I see how fragile FJ are.
  • #20
    5 months ago
    KatitofKatitof Posts: 6,665

    @C3Tooth said:
    Actually 2x M1919 cost 120ammo. And Paratrooper is the only squad able to fire on the move with LMG.

    Actually, LMG obers, bren commandos and airborne guards can do so too.

  • #21
    4 months ago
    SkazzSkazz Posts: 38

    just nuke them with op kayushka or land matress, or better, attack with t34.. its not like they have shreks.

  • #22
    4 months ago
    MorisMoris Posts: 46

    I really like the design of the fallschimjager, but at the same time I understand that they are too good. They have everything that infantry can have in this game. I would not want them to be nerfed, but this is inevitable.

    The only way to solve their problem is to introduce a restriction of one unit on the battlefield like the Wehrmacht officer jaeger.

  • #23
    4 months ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 717

    I had a suggest long time ago that Elite infantry like Ober, Storm, Fall, Para, Ranger, Shock, Guard, Commandos ect should get buffed like 25% more in all stat, but limited to 1 squad only.

    Seriously Jeagar command squad to me isnt that powerful to be limited by 1. A Fall squad alone with only 2 FG still able to kill Jeagar. That so unfair for Ost, and so much favor to Okw

  • #24
    4 months ago
    MorisMoris Posts: 46

    For the rest of the units, this was too much. At the moment, the only problem is fallschimjager.

  • #25
    4 months ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 717

    Fall has all the tools, but they're likely the least men with high cost. They stand alone squad must be good. Though the problem that if you spam them, they can replace core infantry (since they have all tools), unlike other Elite that lack a tool or two. If all of them are limited to 1 or 2 max. The problem will be solved.

    I dont want to see Shock spam because Soviet has no choice vs PzGren spam, then again Ost brings Storm spam because they have no choice vs Shock spam. If we keep Elite limited, gameplay will be more around the core units, which the game was supposed to be. I speak this for the same with Panther vs TDs, currently we barely see any Pz4 Sherman Cromwell

  • #26
    4 months ago

    @Patrol_Omega said:
    Totally disagree @C3Tooth
    In the current state of the game is far harder to claim a Victory against the Werhmacht, rather than against the OKW.
    WER has been getting a list of heavy buffs to it's army, regardeless of how strong that unit was before the patch.
    Not to mention that none of them haven't been reblance and adjusted for an accurate price/performance variable.

    Is WER uncontested meta and with it a boring a game playing on a significant disadvantage or boring if you have free easy games playing that faction in particular.

    *MG42 suppression comes in the first bullet! Not even at the end of the first round! NO INPUT NEDDED
    *MG42 huge and wide range! NO INPUT NEEDEDx2

    *Rifle Grenade has a huge damage output! Wipping out entire squads! NO MAJOR INPUT NEEDEDx3
    Have you seen Allied infantry with such a powerfull grenade? Perhaps Elite Commandos and that's it .. not a mere cheap basic line infantry

    Axis tanks can go straight forward without caring because of the high they get. No major thinking requested

    Panzergrenadiers got both MP and Pop reduction, while getting more and more buffs paired up with 3 Intel Bulletings /fail

    And the list goes on and on

    I've been playing for 7 years and I've decided to register just to say one thing. Who dominates the tables in 1 vs 1? Allies always there. Here it smells like l2p, dealing with falls is the simplest thing in the world, it is a glass cannon. Sniper, granade, light vehicle. Instead of talking so much, upload your games and let us all see why the falls give you problems. And to say that wehr is in a good position when it is currently underperforming faction, you have no credibility. What do you think if we play a game? You with wehr to see that indisputable meta and then we upload it to youtube.

  • #27
    4 months ago

    @C3Tooth said:
    Fall has all the tools, but they're likely the least men with high cost. They stand alone squad must be good. Though the problem that if you spam them, they can replace core infantry (since they have all tools), unlike other Elite that lack a tool or two. If all of them are limited to 1 or 2 max. The problem will be solved.

    I dont want to see Shock spam because Soviet has no choice vs PzGren spam, then again Ost brings Storm spam because they have no choice vs Shock spam. If we keep Elite limited, gameplay will be more around the core units, which the game was supposed to be. I speak this for the same with Panther vs TDs, currently we barely see any Pz4 Sherman Cromwell

    take a walk on twitch and watch the players okw and tell me if you don't see pz4

  • #28
    4 months ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 717
    edited October 2019

    currently we barely see any Pz4 Sherman Cromwell

    Take a walk on this line and tell me if you see dont see pz4

    I repeat the point: gameplay will be more around the core units, not about non-doc unit, but about the backbone units. This is what I hope to have in gameplay.

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