Pathfinder vs Jeager

#1
3 weeks ago
C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549
edited August 27 in General Discussion


-Setup becon: Let Paratrooper drop safely
+Camoflage when stay in cover
.
.
.

-Gs43: Become Sniper but 4x tougher.
-Booby trap: Kill enemy models when they try to capture point before an attack.
-Sprint: Out run MGs setup, or make short retreat.
-Scavenger: Collect resources.
-Medkit: Keep Jeager behind enemy line, not to retreat.
+Camoflage when move in cover
Epic Dec 2018 update: +pop out from buildings, cost 250mp
.
.
.

I wait for players who says they plays both side comment here.

Comments

  • #2
    3 weeks ago
    38Lightning38Lightni… Posts: 302
    They do have a whole lot of abilities.

    So in this fight they are upgraded with gs43?
    As far as the fighting power I might test pathfinders with a bar equipped.

    I will say I have not thought about these two units.
  • #3
    3 weeks ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549

    Without Gs43, PF wins just slightly over Jeager, like 10% health left.

    PF is a long range infantry. I dont know its about the weapons they arm or their stat that great at long range. But because I always think its their stat, I only wait there is a M1919 or LMG42 drop so I let them pick up.

    I will wait for your test of PF +Bar. But whatever, their cost is quite high for non-fighting ability.

  • #4
    3 weeks ago
    38Lightning38Lightni… Posts: 302
    I would show my video but you tube is haveing malfunctions right now and it is unavailable.

    But yes pathfinders are getting beat down. i even tested with both of them max vet and pathfinders get beat down + pathfinders with double bars are losing at medium to long range and i had to micro the units as they died on my last test to keep them as close as possible to the Jaegers to finally defeat them but with only a sliver of health remaining.

    it was quite depressing to watch.
  • #5
    3 weeks ago
    38Lightning38Lightni… Posts: 302
  • #6
    3 weeks ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549

    Well balanced.
    We will see how things go with Fallschrim this Sep.

  • #7
    3 weeks ago
    Balanced_GamerBalanced_… Posts: 200

    Well I mean there is a difference in timing.

    0CP Pathfinder
    2CP Jagers

    In terms of performance difference in its current state as well what was presented in the video, Jagers are somewhat better.

    Pathfinders should be somewhat on par but then both either should be 0CP or 2CP.

    I guess that is how they balance it, also according to timing I suppose.

    I still think both of these units should be a default unit. A tech for making them available in both factions.

  • #8
    3 weeks ago
    38Lightning38Lightni… Posts: 302
    even so double bar did not make much of a difference.
    then besides fighting power they cost slightly more in manpower.
    they have only 1 ability.

    to me pathfinders are more expensive in the long run.

    Jaegers are only 1cp
  • #9
    2 weeks ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549

    PF ability isnt even for fighting or tactic support. Its just let Paratroops to safe drop that Fallschrim doesnt need it to safe drop

    Jea booby trap can take down some models so Jea can fight enemy and keep the point cut off. Sprint can help Jea outrun behind MG setup or soft retreat, then Medkit to keep them stay behind the line, not to retreat.

  • #10
    2 weeks ago
    addvaluejackaddvaluej… Posts: 48
    edited September 1

    I do think sprint is redundant for Jeager.

    But beacon could reveal units on mini-map and it is free while booby trap cost ammunition.

    PF is using M1 Carbine (same as Rangers and Paratroopers) which perform much better than Kr98 at close range.

  • #11
    2 weeks ago
    FaxFax Posts: 46

    But G43s are much better than M1 carbines and Jeags in general have much more utility and options than PF do

    Maybe give access to 1 upgrade of 1 M1919LMG for mid-lategame, locked behind tech?

    I don't usually play with USF and idk how strong that combination might be but I'm just saying that might give them a better chance or fighting back judging by the video

  • #12
    2 weeks ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549
    There are vids that Axis players complain how powerful PF are when they pick up a LMG42 from Gren. And because their description says theyre a long ranger fighter. So let them pick up Bar is pointless. They should pick LMG42 or 34 or M1919.

    But give them ability to upgrade M1919 without any utility will make them a fighter, not support. I prefer to have them being a unit that support disrupting behind the line for Paratroop.

    Example give them medkit and smoke. Smoke to cover Para from pinning or prepare an assault. Becon and medkit to help Para gain full models and health behind the line.

    Currently Jea just better in both disrupt behind the line and fighting than PF
  • #13
    2 weeks ago

    @Fax said:
    But G43s are much better than M1 carbines and Jeags in general have much more utility and options than PF do

    No, scoped G43 is only situationally better than M1. Scoped G43 has 0.1 accuracy modifier while moving (most other weapon has 0.5) and has horrible base accuracy at close range. In other words, it perform worse than Conscripts' Mosin Nagant at close range. And it cost 60 ammunition, same as a LMG.

  • #14
    2 weeks ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549
    edited September 2

    Why compare Jea who fight at long range to a close range squad Cons? Their Oohra ability is designed to give them charge in close to Gren who is good at long range but not in close range.

    Pion 200mp can eat up RM 280mp if they start the fight at close range.
    Sturm 300mp can lose to RM if they keep fighting at long range.
    That Jea vs Cons comparision is pointless

  • #15
    2 weeks ago
    FaxFax Posts: 46

    @C3Tooth said:
    There are vids that Axis players complain how powerful PF are when they pick up a LMG42 from Gren. And because their description says theyre a long ranger fighter. So let them pick up Bar is pointless. They should pick LMG42 or 34 or M1919.

    But give them ability to upgrade M1919 without any utility will make them a fighter, not support. I prefer to have them being a unit that support disrupting behind the line for Paratroop.

    Example give them medkit and smoke. Smoke to cover Para from pinning or prepare an assault. Becon and medkit to help Para gain full models and health behind the line.

    Currently Jea just better in both disrupt behind the line and fighting than PF

    I like the smoke Idea, but if they're long range infantry... wouldn't that kinda go against it? I mean smoke is good to close range infantry like shocks

  • #16
    2 weeks ago
    38Lightning38Lightni… Posts: 302
    edited September 2
    At the very least Simply give pathfinders the ability to spawn from buildings.

    This in turn allows them to set up a beacon to deploy paratroopers and have a reinforce point.

    Give paratroopers with thompsons upgrade smoke (or like stated give pathfinders smoke since they cannot be reinforced) and keep paratroopers with lmg upgrades suppression.

    Then you can drop support weapons behinde enemy lines pick them up and reinforce.

    Paratroopers eventually gain passive healing with vet so no need for med kit

    Could also do like in Soviet doctrin and airdrop weapons packages in exchange for at gun which is less mobile and dont make sense.

    Any unit that picks up the package gets m1919lmg.

    Paratroopers now instead of haveing lmg upgrades have the ability to upgrade to 2x bazookas like their other commander based counterparts.
  • #17
    2 weeks ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549

    I like the smoke Idea, but if they're long range infantry... wouldn't that kinda go against it? I mean smoke is good to close range infantry like shocks

    In this case if you give smoke to Para, they will become Shock with more utility. As my idea of smoke for PF, its to support Para, as in they will "open the path", walk forward an MG, take some hit, smoke that MG so Para can get close in. Its like Rear smoke for Riflemen type of playing.

    Beside giving smoke for PF can help them go back when accidently walk toward an MG nest, so they dont have to retreat. And medkit to keep them full health behind the line, since its really hard to move them up to behind enemy line.

  • #18
    1 week ago
    SkazzSkazz Posts: 18

    cant compare theese 2 units really, thats like comparing the op-kayushka to the not so op panzerwerfer arty. Life ain't fair.

  • #19
    1 week ago
    > @Skazz said:
    > cant compare theese 2 units really, thats like comparing the op-kayushka to the not so op panzerwerfer arty. Life ain't fair.

    Panzerwerfer is half the cost of a katusha......
    Pathfinders cost more than jaegers
  • #20
    1 week ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549
    edited September 12
    Pzwerfer shoot 10 rockets at once, with pin ability. Its likely to force enemy infantry to fall back.

    Kat shoot 16 rockets, split into 4x4 that the duration last 14sec. Infantry can take some hit from the first 4 rocket then able to walk away from the firing area.

    Kat is better at deny enemy infantry from capping Vic point. Not deal damage due to slow firing
    - - -
    Path finder isnt mean to be front line, their main purpose is to help paratroops drop safety, which is support role. However they dont have any ability to make them a true support unit.
  • #21
    1 week ago
    SkazzSkazz Posts: 18

    think it only supresses right? anyway, you dont have to worry for squadwhipes per rocket witch kayushka is very effective at, and destroying buildings.. and tanks.. sorry for straying from the topic. But i can agree that if a unit is totally worthless something could have to be done, but is pathfinder worthless? i mean falchirmsjeger usually get rekt be4 they land :s

  • #22
    1 week ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549

    Paratrooper rekt themselves to world objects if there is no becon. Fallschrim can drop any where they land.

    If Pathfinder only exist just to let Paratroop drop safety behind the line, I rather use that 290mp and add another 70mp to land another Paratrooper at my base. For now Pathfinder only have some usage with picking 2 Zook and hide behind the line to ambush very low health retreat tanks.

    38LIGHTNING already showed between Pathfinder and a Bar vs Jeager and Gs43. Which Jeager still win over for the same ammo price but 10mp lower price. But I dont ask to buff Pathfinder fire power. I only ask Pathfinder should have some ability that able to support further for Para. Just a smoke screen would do enough.


    Im sorry for the Pzwerfer being weaker than Kat eventhough it come later.
    But Allies players have bigger complain: Walking stuka at 8min.

  • #23
    1 week ago
    SkazzSkazz Posts: 18

    paratroopers vs fallchirm, if intressted

  • #24
    1 week ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549
    edited September 12


    Paratrooper vs Fallschirm tactical power, if interested


    If you say Para able to pick up high pen Zook for AT power, but its nonsense because they sacrifice their superior AI power (tactical assault & volley fire). Ranger with Zooks is more reasonable since they're able to pick 3 Zooks.

    Para can not camoflage, you can put 5 Fall all around the place in camo and do heavy ambush.

    Para is super weak until give them 100ammo weapons.

    Fall able to sprint through For the Father land, Para isnt.

  • #25
    1 week ago
    @Skazz ya I've seen this idk what you intend to show.

    paratroopers 360 manpower 120 munitions double lmg
    Vs 320mp fallschimjager 60 munitions drops 4 almost 5 models of paratroopers yet paratroopers must remain stationary to use their lmg and fallschimjager can retain most of their firepower on the move.
    Watch how fast paratroopers die when fallschimjager runs up close range....

    Then fallschimjager still has panzerfaust and a better grenade fore wipeing squads and Vets up to gain caustic smoke does not need a support squad for safe landings can get major buff from for the fatherland and can reinforce anywhere on the battlefield with stuka support backing them up.

    Sure is a good thing they got buffed
  • #26
    1 week ago
    SkazzSkazz Posts: 18

    well i dont know, i almost only play 4v4 and paratroopers still rek my fallschirms head on post patch :/

  • #27
    1 week ago
    38Lightning38Lightni… Posts: 302
    edited September 13
    @Skazz Ya you dont play head on long range vs double lmg or go close range to quad Thompsons.

    But if you know the weapon you know the range they are weakest at and fallschimjager can do both ranges very well especially if you ambush the enemy.

    It's like rifleman dont stay long range vs volks but dont charge into sturmpioneer either so stop and acess the situation to figure out ways to aproach the situation. Perhaps add in a mortar to take out volks in heavy cover or heavy machine gun to stop charging sturmpioneer.
    Perhaps wait around the corner of a building to get the jump on volks you know are coming to avoid the long range engagements or use mortar smoke to conceal your aproach into a shorter range.

    Usf has had to make alot of judgment calls and tactical repositioning in order to come out on top so very used to it.

    either way paratroopers are far more expensive even if you just look at the munitions
    Lmg 120munitions or thompson 90 munitions I would prey to god they can handily win in a fight and not bleed manpower.

    Which is why some of their vet 3 was removed and added to the base unit stats to be better early on before they are able to get their weapon upgrades as to not bleed manpower especially in consideration to fallschimjager buff.
  • #28
    1 week ago
    C3ToothC3Tooth Posts: 549

    They got adjusted to be weaker in early, but even more op than before in late game (due to late x2 FG but has various fire power buff)

    I remember the day when I had 2 Paratrooper squads but without any weapon upgrade due to no ammo, a vet3 Fall squad kill 2 Para squad in close range. And this is the case of 760mp lose to 380mp. Because that 760mp had no 200ammo weapon upgrade.

    As long as there is no ammo, USF infantry dont have any automatic weapon (at least Soviet has Shock, Brit has Commandos requires only mp), this is why ammo is more important to USF than fuel.

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