[UKF] Smoke auto magic repair ability

#1
2 years ago

This thing is a joke. You should not be able to perform this in your enemy's base as a bare minimum of a nerf. A pak gun cannot out dps the repair rate; buying time for the player in a broken unbalanced way. This thing is on 3 commanders too.

Make it cost more.

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Comments

  • #2
    2 years ago
    LazarusLazarus Posts: 4,073

    Just add the same condition as sniper camo, only applies when you're out of combat for I think it's 10 seconds.

  • #3
    2 years ago
    SquishyMuffinSquishyMu… Posts: 434
    edited July 2017
    @Lazarus that is a sensible and good idea. But how can that condition be met? What if some infantry is in combat? Can the game be clever enough to know when all tanks are out of combat?
  • #4
    2 years ago
    LazarusLazarus Posts: 4,073

    I just meant applicable on a tank by tank basis. You pop the ability and all your out of combat tanks are smoked/repaired, all in combat tanks are not, until they are out of combat for 10 sec.

  • #5
    2 years ago
    KatitofKatitof Posts: 6,651

    @Lazarus said:
    Just add the same condition as sniper camo, only applies when you're out of combat for I think it's 10 seconds.

    The whole point of the ability is to use it IN combat.
    That's why there is smoke there.

  • #6
    2 years ago
    LazarusLazarus Posts: 4,073

    @Katitof said:

    @Lazarus said:
    Just add the same condition as sniper camo, only applies when you're out of combat for I think it's 10 seconds.

    The whole point of the ability is to use it IN combat.
    That's why there is smoke there.

    I know, and the whole point of Air Supremacy was to completely annihilate forward points, and then we realized it was a bad idea so we nerfed it. Welcome to the balance section, where things change.

  • #7
    2 years ago
    KatitofKatitof Posts: 6,651

    @Lazarus said:

    @Katitof said:

    @Lazarus said:
    Just add the same condition as sniper camo, only applies when you're out of combat for I think it's 10 seconds.

    The whole point of the ability is to use it IN combat.
    That's why there is smoke there.

    I know, and the whole point of Air Supremacy was to completely annihilate forward points, and then we realized it was a bad idea so we nerfed it. Welcome to the balance section, where things change.

    Psst, still anything in air supremacy area will be evaporated, just not okw trucks anymore.
    The intended use of the ability is completely unchanged.

    Which is exact opposite of what's being suggested here.

  • #8
    2 years ago
    VipperVipper Posts: 3,723
    edited July 2017

    "Vehicle crew repairs" (UKF) (100 MU) is OP (far more cost efficient) compared to other similar abilities like:

    1) OKW "Emergency crew repairs" (50MU)
    2) Soviet "Vehicle crew repair training" (30 MU-50% munitions penalty)

  • #9
    2 years ago
    LazarusLazarus Posts: 4,073
    edited July 2017

    @Katitof said:

    @Lazarus said:

    @Katitof said:

    @Lazarus said:
    Just add the same condition as sniper camo, only applies when you're out of combat for I think it's 10 seconds.

    The whole point of the ability is to use it IN combat.
    That's why there is smoke there.

    I know, and the whole point of Air Supremacy was to completely annihilate forward points, and then we realized it was a bad idea so we nerfed it. Welcome to the balance section, where things change.

    Psst, still anything in air supremacy area will be evaporated, just not okw trucks anymore.

    Right. Not OKW trucks, which is what I said. For more examples, see all vet gain abilities. Or snipers in clown cars. Again - welcome to the balance section, where things change. Unless you're suggesting that the game is completely identical to its release build?

  • #10
    2 years ago
    SkysTheLimitSkysTheLi… Posts: 2,271
    edited July 2017

    I always thought the Brit Crew Repairs seemed like it should be one of those sector-based abilities. Like you click it in one of your own territories, and then the vehicles in that sector get smoked an repaired. Gives it a little micro-requirement instead of just clicking your way to better health, and stops you from being able to repair things all over the map.

    I think the "oh ****" nature of the ability should be preserved, just narrowed in scope.

  • #11
    2 years ago
    LazarusLazarus Posts: 4,073

    @SkysTheLimit said:
    I always thought the Brit Crew Repairs seemed like it should be one of those sector-based abilities. Like you click it in one of your own territories, and then the vehicles in that sector get smoked an repaired. Gives it a little micro-requirement instead of just clicking your way to better health, and stops you from being able to repair things all over the map.

    I think the "oh ****" nature of the ability should be preserved, just narrowed in scope.

    It's a good idea in theory, but the problem is the nature of the game, especially the larger modes, is that tanks tend to roam in blobs so generally speaking they're going to be in the same sector anyway. Making it only applicable in its own territories would be a good idea.

    The other option would be rather than make it a global tank ability would be to make it a global Sapper ability, so smoke drops on all vehicles and Sappers have a short period where their repair speed is buffed. The problem with that is you'd need to cap it so multiple Sappers can't all blob repair a vehicle and restore it instantly. I suppose you could make it a passive non-stacking aura that very slowly repairs tanks within a short distance of sappers, so that you still require them to be close by. You can just have the passive repair make up the difference between normal sapper repair and current ability performance.

  • #12
    2 years ago
    SkysTheLimitSkysTheLi… Posts: 2,271
    edited July 2017
    @Lazarus Yeah the limited to own territories is the part I think definitely needs to be brought in. That or they could make it so the smoking part of the ability only works in your territory, thus adding a greater risk factor if you use it while you have a tank in neutral/hostile territory.

    They could also reduce the up-front cost a little (maybe not at all) and add a munitions penalty kind of like the soviet one. Maybe like -20% for each tank that is getting repaired or something. The absurd cost efficiency of it comes from the fact that it costs you the same whether it's repairing 1 tank or 5. And even if it's only 1, if there's any faction that can throw away 100 muni to repair 1 tank, it's the Brits.
  • #13
    2 years ago
    _Aqua__Aqua_ Posts: 1,951

    @Lazarus said:
    It's a good idea in theory, but the problem is the nature of the game, especially the larger modes, is that tanks tend to roam in blobs so generally speaking they're going to be in the same sector anyway. Making it only applicable in its own territories would be a good idea.

    The other option would be rather than make it a global tank ability would be to make it a global Sapper ability, so smoke drops on all vehicles and Sappers have a short period where their repair speed is buffed. The problem with that is you'd need to cap it so multiple Sappers can't all blob repair a vehicle and restore it instantly. I suppose you could make it a passive non-stacking aura that very slowly repairs tanks within a short distance of sappers, so that you still require them to be close by. You can just have the passive repair make up the difference between normal sapper repair and current ability performance.

    That would work, but might be a pain to program in the mod tools. Lowering the repair rate while increasing the time (so same amount healed, over a longer period) would prevent the cheesy crap Squishy is talking about while retaining the current performance.

  • #14
    2 years ago
    LazarusLazarus Posts: 4,073
    edited July 2017

    @SkysTheLimit While it's a good thought, the problem with manipulating the cost is as you said - the Brits absolutely swim in muni until time stops. There are very few abilities that will actually break their bank, Dresden Bombers comes to mind. My only fear with price tweaking is to finally make it expensive enough to actually impact their muni economy and make people second guess their choice, would be to make it so prohibitively expensive that it just isn't worth it - killing the ability.

    @Aqua I've seen AoE repair in mods on "repair halftracks" so it is at least possible. Really, in theory you're just using the same thing as the Tommy med squad aura, except repair instead of heal, and on Sappers instead of Tommies so it's certainly doable.

    Longer time, lower healing is a much more straightforward solution - but frankly I've never been keen on "self sustainable" tanks. One more shot on the T-70 was one thing, but with the stat line that Brit tanks can have I just feel forcing players to at least have a single repair squad near by would move it away from the insta-click cure all.

  • #15
    2 years ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822
    The ability is incredibly powerful, and cost effective. It certainly needs something to bring it in line. Even per unit self smoke AND repair is pretty strong, especially if its a flat cost (compare to okw crit repair or soviet repair that puts a penalty on muni income, locks the tank if it comes into combat while repairing AND has an upfront cost)
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