USF Commander Revamp Discussion

#1
1 year ago
Andy_REAndy_RE Posts: 260 admin

Please use this thread to discuss or submit ideas for the USF Commander Revamp

If you want to submit a full proposal, here are a few guidelines.

  • Please choose commanders that you feel can realistically become competitive with a few good changes. Some commanders are probably beyond redemption at this point. We are aiming to revamp two commanders per faction.
  • Reminder that all proposed changes, must be preexisting units or abilities currently in the live game.
  • Suggested changes should not detract from the commanders given theme.
  • Please provide the rationale behind your proposed changes, and how they will improve said commander.
  • Where applicable, provide costs, CP values, or other details regarding particular change(s)
«13

Comments

  • #2
    1 year ago
    thefonztmthefonztm Posts: 2
    edited July 2018

    Edit: aaaand I confused two commanders in my post... It's not me! It's the commanders who are confused! : P

    My follow up post below might clear up any questions this post leaves in your head due to my goof! I'm gonna wait and see other peoples thoughts, then maybe separate these two correctly. XD

    MechanoArmorized CompanyThingy - Refocus on vehicle crews & light vehicles

    0 CP - Assault Engineers Goodbye! (may return later)

    • Why have 2 smg squads in focus here?

    0 CP - Elite Vehicle Crews

    • Allow Thompson upgrade on all crews and/or crews that have picked up a dropped weapon. (Specifically - M20 crew, whatever reason they can't have thompsons.)
    • Crews always insta-bail. Or at least much faster than current in combat bailing.
    • Crews can plant a scuttling charge on abandoned vehicles/equipment. 15 muns. 3 second (?) plant time with recieved accuracy penalty. Guaranteed destruction or set amount of damage like a mine? Probably latter. Detonate after a few seconds. Can be discovered and removed by sweeper engies. Edit: Base it off the para/commando demo charges.
    • Consider cost adjustments - But play around with crews that can more reliably escape & having a half track for front line reinforcements before slashing the price.

    3 CP - M3 Halftrack (Assault Group?)

    • Could go either way here. Depends on how necessary it is to have access to a flamer for anti-garrison. Alternatively, no assault group means a cheaper & more replacible Half Track. I favor Half Track only. Mechanized company should have advantage on open groud, and gain it's garrision pushing punch with 105 sherman & barrage
    • Half Track forms the heart of the mechanized army. Keeps it in the field. Mobile suppression as an option to come to the aid of vehicles about to go down to infantry AT.

    8 CP - M10

    • No Change

    8 CP - M10

    • No Change

    12 CP - 240mm Howitzer Barrage

    • Try and make it less of a crapshoot or another barrage?

    Looking to make elite crews elite.

    Always insta bail rewards aggressive use of vehicles. Makes thompsons more relevant since you are more likely to have spare crews. And even makes investing in Thompsons for crews that still have vehicles less of an insane proposition.

    Scuttling charge makes bailing worth it in situations where the vehicle is doomed, but bailing just gives your enemy a free asset. Now the crew can deny the enemy the resource. No more just sitting your crew there hoping a shot hits the vehicle or hastily sending some other unit to destroy the abandoned vehicle.

    Spare crews & the thompson upgrade fill the role of an SMG unit & more access to repair. Loss of mines/demo/flamer/wire on a front line unit is a change, but is this a mechanized company, or a dig-in company?

    I'm hoping this idea opens up light vehicle play for mechanized company. I specifically mention the M20 & it's crew getting thompsons because IMO it's the key non-doctrinal unit to increase light vehicle action with mechanized, and also because no/later ass engies means no/later mines. With the M20 giving vision & a half track dropping/reinforcing troops, you have the potential for decisive and fast light vehicle & infantry attacks. Mines and zooks fill the role of stop gapping the enemy rushing medium or heavier armor, while you have spent more fuel on several light vehicles.

    Lastly, while of course I like my idea and would say tweak it before you pitch it, I'm not a top 200 player and my ideas about how things will be used may reflect that in how more skilled players implement/counter them.


    I suck at forums, been a while. Preserving this text because my reply to mognats disappeared.

    @mognats said:
    Mechanized company is almost in a great spot.

    .... describes Armor company at length just like I did.......
    

    ..... I apologize if I just caused you to make the same name goof I did.

    I was talking about Armor Company

    I consider this more evidence that armor company and mechanized company are mixed up commanders.

    The 76 sherman probably belongs in armor company. The m10 can go to mechanized, fitting it's light and fast theme. The current set up might be a relic (pardon) of keeping the 76mm sherman a soviet call in at the time USF launched and/or a desire to feature the M10 somewhere, before mechanized was created

    Now that I've got the two separated in my head. Without tweaks to function in mind, I'd theme these out better with changes like:

    Armor Company

    Lose Elite Vehicle Crews.
    Lose M10.
    Gain 76mm Sherman.
    Gain Withdraw and refit.

    Swap up your armor composition late game as the battle requires. Hell yea.

    Mechanized Company

    Lose 76mm Sherman
    Lose either M21 mortar half track or WC51
    Gain Elite vehicle crews (with my above recommendations)
    Gain M10
    Change M3 Assault group to Regular M3

    .... Thinking it over, I'd say lose the M21 Mortar HT. I'm worried it gives up too much indirect. Possibly compensated by giving sprint to infantry with the elite vehicle crews? Emphasize speed and manuever to deal with static & crew weapons

  • #3
    1 year ago
    mognatsmognats Posts: 6

    Mechanized company is almost in a great spot.

    0CP - Assault Engineer - keep this, they're fine. They are squishy and provide good utility.

    0CP - Elite Vehicle crews - this should be replaced. In no match ever played is there a USF player that decrews a vehicle and uses their thompson's around a map. It's too risky and too much of a challenge to decrew an almost destroyed vehicle. It would be better to replace this ability with the repair half track from Ardennes Assault.

    8CP - M10 Tank Destroyer - keep this it's perfect.

    8CP - Sherman Bulldozer - I suggest that the Sherman Bulldozer gets a projectile speed increase similar to that of the Brummbar. Otherwise the dozer is fine. It can provide good cover or take it down. It's a bit weird about placement. The shells are just very slow and unenjoyable.

    12CP - 240mm Howitzer Barrage - This needs to be reworked or removed. Perhaps it could be exchanged for a precision strike, a smoke barrage, or even a reworked anti tank overwatch from Dog Company of Ardennes assault. I do feel that all USF call downs are heavily delayed as opposed to their Axis counterparts. perhaps a faster flare to calldown would be better as well.

  • #4
    1 year ago
    mariomario Posts: 10

    I think the USF is missing a new tank fighter like the hellcat and an explorer like a jeep as well as the COH 1 and a sniper

  • #5
    1 year ago
    The Big Red 1The Big R… Daly City, CA, USAPosts: 681
    edited July 2018

    The M26 pershing for the Heavy Cav company could use a Health/Armor buff because the resources you are paying for you are not getting your money's worth (axis tanks get their money's worth no fair!). it is either that or make it cheaper imho. funny how comet tanks are 185 FU and you get what you pay for using them and they seem to last longer than an M26 when i use them.

  • #6
    1 year ago
    thefonztmthefonztm Posts: 2
    edited July 2018

    Copy - pasting some discussion on the idea that elite crew could have an ability to scuttle their vehicles. Perhaps it could/should be implemented as an alternative way to exit the vehicle. EG, press T to exit normally, press K to exit & destroy the vehicle.


    I'm just a little unsure of how practical the scuttle charge will be. It's a cool idea don't get me wrong, but I just cant think of too many situations in which you'd be able to safely plant a charge for 3secs without having something else that could just destroy the wreck itself.

    As I typed the below out... agreed that 3 seconds is too long.

    Mostly cases where small arms damage would kill the vehicle. Like a weak half track being chased by the grens that fausted it. In a heavier AT situation, a smart player will see you bailing to save the squad and not kill the vehicle, or prioritize vehicles is on - you bailed so they won't auto fire. Besides, do we really want to play the game of baiting a shot with the squad you are trying to save to kill the vehicle? Could definitely be more like a 1-2 second plant. A heavy received accuracy penalty to make the crew vulnerable is needed, balanced by vehicles giving green cover. Don't be exposed when you scuttle.

    A related issue... because bailing in combat (currently) has like a 3 second process, you need to bail early to bail at all. So you can't reliably game the enemy's killing shot with your 'elite' crew. Usually means you either fail the bail, or leave a 1/4 HP gift for the enemy. Thinking tanks taking fire here, not so much light vehicles. A quick scuttle here would be nice.

    and

    Recently had a great example of where scuttle would fit in a tank fight. Playing a team game, we had just drawn the enemy KT too far out. It had demolished a few brit units, but gets suprised when 3 76mm shermans charge in. Lose 2 of the shermans, but get a third behind the KT and seal the deal. Escape through smoke deeper into german lines (away from AT infantry). When I think I'm clear, minestrike!

    Tank is a sliver of HP so I bail the crew. Admittedly forgot about repair critical, but driving a 1 shot tank back through the front is suicide.

    So bailed the crew and saved a vet 2 tank crew at the cost of leaving a 76 sherm.

  • #7
    1 year ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346
    edited July 2018

    @thefonztm How about insta-bail also meaning that some of the crew always survives vehicle destruction? RNG could determine how many make it out. Get lucky, it's the whole crew; having a bad day, only one guy makes it out. Then, the crew goes rogue, fighting to make it back to the safety of their lines. If any of them make it, they're eligible for "withdraw and refit". Rewarding both aggressive play and concern for your crews' safety.

  • #8
    1 year ago
    BazookaDreBazookaDre Posts: 21

    I've been lurking these forums for a while and well I figured this would be a good time to post at least something to contribute to one of my favorite games. In regards to the USF Forces, the follow in the revamp that I think would be helpful in fixing up one of the commanders I feel are lacking a bit.

    Armored Company:
    This company has suffered an identity crisis since release. One would think armored company would come with the best or some of the best armor in the game and options that would facilitate armored play. In addition...Wolverines come out when you already have the option of Jacksons and Shermans...its just a mess at the moment. Here are my proposed changes to Armored Company.

    First the ommissions:

    Drop Assault Engineers. Assault engineers feel like they belong in another company to be fair.

    Now for the reworked abilities:

    Reserve Armor or Easy 8 - I'm leaning more Reserve armor. Give armored company good armored units essentially. While some would say why not the Pershing...this is about deploying good armor in decent numbers. A single Pershing won't do this.

    M10 Wolverine - I'm going to propose something a bit radical here, but why not make the Wolverine deploy with the Captain? Its not a very good tank destroyer...but can be a nice early vehicle. Once the Major is on the field, there really is no reason to get a Wolverine. Jacksons and Shermans will just do better, and with reserve armor or E8s on the field, you'd have less of a reason. I'm ok if the unit gets a bit tweaked so its not OP at this phase.

    Elite Tankcrews need a rework. Instead of a submachine gun, or with it, it should perhaps do something in regards to their initial veterancy or their repair abilities. I literally never use this ability, but I can see maybe something nice done to the crews that give them a small...BOUGHT...upgrade that helps them.

    Keep as is:

    105mm Sherman is fine and so is the artillery. However...bulldozers on regular and 105mm Sherman's might seem silly. However, the 105 mm Sherman can be more of an indirect fire unit.

    If I think of a second commander to change up, I'll suggest it, but I think the next weakest company that needs some love is recon.

  • #9
    1 year ago

    Sniper for USA! Make America great again!

  • #10
    1 year ago

    Recon Support Company needs to completely retooled. As it stands, this commander requires huge resource commitments for little payoff, and it's best aspects are done better by other factions. Forward Observers and Pathfinders are both great, but then things get... icky.

    The M8 Greyhound badly needs some sort of utility beyond being fast, and I feel that it could be given any number of simple upgrades. At the very least, it should be able to deploy smoke similar to smoke grenades on other units to cover its retreat. Besides this, I see great potential in the Greyhound, as it could work best with what this commander does in a variety of ways. It could be given a map ping ability, the ability to lay mines, sweep for mines (this one is a must for such a weak unit and fits the recon support concept perfectly), fire a round that will actually make it somewhat useful against armor.... Currently, the only saving grace of the M8 is that it's cheap. By the time it can be deployed, it will lose almost any direct combat it engages in; even the canister shot is no guarantee that it will be able to overcome infantry. Instead of adjusting its stats, make it able to actually do what its intended to do.

    Aerial Recon Sweep is fine. Boring and kind of redundant with everything else here, but tried and true. As Pathfinders can already call in artillery, an offensive support ability is probably not needed here. But, what if this ability could be given an extra feature? For an increase in cost, this ability could also be given some further utility when used in a territory containing triangulation sets, pathfinders, or greyhounds to add a degree of skill. If used in an area where one of these units are present, the recon sweep becomes a strafing run or even neutralizes a capture point. The essence of this suggestion is basically this: When everything else this commander does ensures visibility and map information, what's the point of wasting a slot on yet another Recon Sweep, and a redundant one at that? This slot should work with the previous ones, not make them less useful.

    Airdropped Combat Group. Airdropped. Combat. Group. I get what this is going for, but it's implemented in a way that actually makes it a detriment to use. Two squads of airborne and an AT take time to deploy and get oriented, so using this in a combat zone makes this a waste of 900 manpower. Without guaranteed suppression weapons, this group will not be able to hold out without support once deployed. Even when used safely, this ability is still too costly and eats up pop cap like nothing else. However, what I like about this is that the ability synergizes perfectly with the rest of the ability tree. With this in mind, why not have this ability deploy the squads from an ambient building like Stormtroopers? The AT gun could drop elsewhere, or the airborne squads could simply be equipped with AT weapons themselves or random equipment from any faction. Deploy a .50cal (or Axis MG) team with them to make up for the lost crew gun. Make it seem like these airborne guys have spent the past night hunting, killing, and scavenging like it's the lead-up to D-Day. This is an idea that isn't in the game, but maybe give them an expensive ability which lets them decrew and capture enemy vehicles with some grenades down the hatches, inflicting a engine critical in the process so this ability doesn't become Grand Theft Panzer. Think about it: While the recon units scout the battlefield, specially-assigned paratroopers inserted the night before rendezvous with the main force at a key moment in the conflict to turn the tide of battle. This is the commander's penultimate ability, and it should not feel like an impotent waste.

    Final thoughts: The biggest issue with this commander seems to be keeping up with tempo. Almost all of its abilities are underpowered or overcosted, and only the recon sweep stays relevant once the enemy starts building tanks. This commander is at a serious disadvantage in 1v1, and in any other matchup there's sure to be a better option. The fact that OKW gets the IR Halftrack standard (which is a light vehicle like the M8 and does the job of triangulation but better without taking up two command ability slots) makes the Recon Company even more of a disappointment. I've long thought that this commander has immense potential to be fun and powerful, but badly needs to be cleaned up.

  • #11
    1 year ago
    LorenLoren Posts: 22

    The Airborne Company, the Armor Company, and the **Rifle Company **all think a little re-balancing is needed.

    First, the Rifle Company has lost its own concept. During Rifle Company's Commander Skill, the skill to strengthen Rifleman is almost useless 'Fire up!' Only. 'Fire up!' Skill is a skill that is rarely used due to a high Munition cost, late unlocking time, and a discharge penalty compared to Soviet's 'Ura!'. These characteristics do not quite match the concept of a commander. Rifleman Company might rather be called 'Easy Eight Company'. I think it would be inappropriate for the Rifleman Company to rebalance the old 1919a6 Defencive Formantion skill for the Rifleman Company.

    Instead, I think 'Sherman Easy Eight' is what it gives to the Armor Company. Armor Company The M10 is no longer a 'call in' method, so it has less of a merit to produce M10 than Jackson. A special advantage of the Armor Company is that the benefits of the M10 have disappeared and many have been faded. The Sherman bulldozzer's 105mm howitzers are not very attractive, which fades many of the characteristics of this commander. So, I think it's a good idea to hand over 'Sherman Easy Eight' to fix these areas.

    The efficiency of the** Airborne Company and its core Paratrooper is also a big problem** . The evasion bonus of the Airborne Company's Paratrooper's stats is set too low to fit high-level infantry. After '1vet', it has the same evasion bonus as Soviet's Conscripts. (1v to 2vt: 0%, 3vt: 29%) This can be produced at 380 manpower cost and 3cp, which is not an attractive option given the specific commander requirement. Furthermore, instead of upgrading the two 1919a6s, when upgrading Thompson, the Close Combat unit becomes a very low evasion bonus that is even harder to use. Considering that the units that do most close combat have a very high evasion bonus but are hard to use, the evasion bonus of Thompson paratroopers is really a big hurdle to use.
    So in most cases, the Airborne Company is often chosen to support heavy weapons, which breaks the rigid USF tier tech structure. This makes it seem more appropriate to call the Airsupport Company than to be an Airborne Company.

    In my opinion, there are a lot of things in the USF that do not take advantage of the characteristics of each of these commanders, and I hope this revision will be made in this rework.

  • #12
    1 year ago
    LorenLoren Posts: 22
    edited July 2018

    The Airborne Company, the Armor Company, and the Rifle Company all think a little rework is needed.

    First, the Rifle Company has lost its own concept. During Rifle Company's Commander Skill, the ONLY skill to strengthen Rifleman is almost useless 'Fire up!' . 'Fire up!' is a skill that is rarely used due to a high Munition cost, late unlocking time, and a discharge penalty compared to Soviet's 'Ura!'. These characteristics do not quite match the concept of a commander. Rifleman Company might rather be called 'Easy Eight Company'. I think it would be a good for the Rifleman Company to give 1919a6, fix 'Fire up!' skill, and rebalance the old 1919a6 Defencive Formantion skill for the Rifleman Company.

    Instead, I think 'Sherman Easy Eight' is what it gives to the Armor Company. Armor Company The M10 is no longer a 'call in' method, so it has less of a merit to produce M10 than Jackson. A special advantage of the Armor Company is that the benefits of the M10 have disappeared and many have been faded. The Sherman bulldozzer's 105mm howitzers are not very attractive, which fades many of the characteristics of this commander. So, I think it's a good idea to hand over 'Sherman Easy Eight' to fix these problems. how about make M10 to 'call in' again, and give sherman upgrades to E8 or dozzers.

    The efficiency of the Airborne Company and its core Paratrooper is also a big problem . The evasion bonus of the Airborne Company's Paratrooper's stats is set too low to fit high-level infantry. After 1vet, it has the same evasion bonus as Soviet's Conscripts. (1vet to 2vet: 0%, 3vet: 29%) This can be produced at 380 manpower cost and 3cp, which is not an attractive option given the specific commander requirement. Furthermore, instead of upgrading the two 1919a6s, when upgrading Thompson, the Close Combat unit becomes a very low evasion bonus that is even harder to use. Considering that the units that do most close combat have a very high evasion bonus but are hard to use, the evasion bonus of Thompson paratroopers is really a big hurdle to use.
    So in most cases, the Airborne Company is often chosen to support heavy weapons, which breaks the rigid USF tier tech structure. It makes them look like the Airsupply Company, not the Airborne Company.

    In my opinion, USF can't to take advantage of the characteristics of each commander. I hope this revision will be done in this work.

  • #13
    1 year ago
    AchlenAchlen Posts: 13

    Airdropped Combat Group. Airdropped. Combat. Group. I get what this is going for, but it's implemented in a way that actually makes it a detriment to use. Two squads of airborne and an AT take time to deploy and get oriented, so using this in a combat zone makes this a waste of 900 manpower. Without guaranteed suppression weapons, this group will not be able to hold out without support once deployed. Even when used safely, this ability is still too costly and eats up pop cap like nothing else. However, what I like about this is that the ability synergizes perfectly with the rest of the ability tree. With this in mind, why not have this ability deploy the squads from an ambient building like Stormtroopers? The AT gun could drop elsewhere, or the airborne squads could simply be equipped with AT weapons themselves or random equipment from any faction. Deploy a .50cal (or Axis MG) team with them to make up for the lost crew gun. Make it seem like these airborne guys have spent the past night hunting, killing, and scavenging like it's the lead-up to D-Day. This is an idea that isn't in the game, but maybe give them an expensive ability which lets them decrew and capture enemy vehicles with some grenades down the hatches, inflicting a engine critical in the process so this ability doesn't become Grand Theft Panzer. Think about it: While the recon units scout the battlefield, specially-assigned paratroopers inserted the night before rendezvous with the main force at a key moment in the conflict to turn the tide of battle. This is the commander's penultimate ability, and it should not feel like an impotent waste.

    You do know they revamped this ability in the last commander revamp update?
    The ability now drops 1 paratrooper squad which can upgrade to 2 .30 cal or 2 bazookas and a 57mm AT gun.
    It costs 325 MP and 50 muni i think.

  • #14
    1 year ago
    HyperBlancatHyperBlan… Posts: 29
    edited July 2018

    Common

    Rifleman : vet 1 anti-tank grenade launcher-> accuracy +10%

    now can use AT grenade when t1 or t2 is upgraded

    garand far accuracy 51.75->55% far cooldown 125%->120%

    vet 3 weapon damage bonus add(bazooka dmg 80->100, garand dmg 8->10)

    BAR muni cost 60->50

    grenade upgrade cost 150mp 25fuel -> 125mp 15fuel

    M20 utility car : cost 320/20 -> 240/30, delete crew bazooka, now equiped skirts basically, Mounted .50cal penetration 3/2/1 -> 7/6/5,
    far accuracy 20% -> 35%

    Major squad size 3->4

    M8 greyhound : 4cp) call-in unit, can build M6 AT mine, cannon dmg 40->60

    Airborne : -8% received accuracy add basically, vet2 field medic -> vet 1

    Thunderbolt rocket strike Muni cost 240 -> 200

    M26 pershing : HP 800 -> 960, HVAP effect add(crew shock or engine destroy),

    Rangers : now can use only 1 squad on the field, add smoke grenade and sachel, Ranger lead the way! buff add(equal to UKF airlanding officer charge)

    1. Rifle company

    0cp) Ez8 tank : add WP round skill(= comet) in vet 1

    0cp) rifleman special trainning : riflemans can build sandbag and mine, can use flare and cocked grenade(need grenade unlock)

    2cp) fire up : equal to weh Encirclement sprint skill, penalty deleted, can use all infantry squad except echelon and weapon team

    3cp) Assult rifleman squad : 3 carbine and 2 thompson equiped, can upgrade 1 M2 flamethrower, can use smoke grenade but cant use AT rifle grenade

    5cp) foward observing artillery support : Lietenant and captain can use rapid barrage skill(120dmg 7rounds 120 muni cost)

    1. Tactical support

    6cp) strafing run -> 12cp) bombing run

    buff calliope rocket AOE dmg

    1. armor company

    wolverin -> 7cp) call-in unit,

    bulldozer -> major tier unit, buff rounds speed

    delete crew thompson upgrade and add Elite crew trainnig(repair speed increase and receive veterancy gain+ 15%)

  • #15
    1 year ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346
    edited July 2018

    I've read all the suggestions posted to this thread and there are plenty of interesting ideas. One thing that hasn't been stated explicitly enough is that some US commanders have abilities or units which do NOT suit their doctrine. I'd like to propose some swaps which might rectify this.

    • Swap the "Easy 8" from the Rifle Company with the Sherman 105 of the Armor Coy. The 105 is a support tank that belongs with the infantry; the "Easy 8" is one of the best US tanks and belongs with the armor. Having an Armor Company that doesn't have a good tank makes no sense.

    • Swap the M2 Flamethrower from the Rifle Company with the Assault Engineers of the Armor Coy. The Assault Engineers make a lot more sense with the Rifle Company, especially when used in conjunction with an assault support tank like the 105. With these changes, the Rifle Company starts to look a lot more like an Assault Company. All of the abilities would now work together during infantry assaults.

    • Swap the Rifleman Field Defenses from the Heavy Cavalry Company with the M5 Half-track of the Tactical Support Coy. A high-mobility unit like cavalry needs the half-track; Field Defenses are much more suited to support.

    These changes would bring the above commanders more into line with their respective doctrines.

    Finally, I would like to reiterate what I said above regarding Elite Vehicle Crews. Simply giving them Thompsons isn't enough - that should be obvious from all the suggestions. They're never going to be infantry nor should they be. The two things that should make them elite would be the ability to repair their vehicle faster and an ability to survive the destruction of their vehicle (how many survive being random). This gives a player an incentive to upgrade that really doesn't exist at this point.

    At this time, once a crew has no vehicle, a player might as well use them as weak infantry because, there really isn't anything else you can do with them. I would like the "Withdraw and Refit" ability restored but only to Elite Vehicle Crews. This not only gives a player another incentive to upgrade the unit; it also means that these crews can be traded for their manpower instead of simply killing them off. The amount of manpower returned to the pool by their withdrawal would be proportional to the number of men that make it back to base safely.

    Additionally, giving elite crews the ability to truly abandon their vehicle by scuttling it makes sense but, it should just be simply "push the button and it catches fire", not a booby trap (for either side).

    With these changes, Elite Vehicle Crews would look like this:

    • Thompson Upgrade (Active with munition cost)
    • Faster Repair (Passive)
    • Enhanced Survival (Passive)
    • Scuttle Vehicle (Active with small munitions cost)
    • Withdraw & Refit (Active with manpower reclaim)

    Well, that's my two cents worth.

  • #16
    1 year ago
    Dangminh25Dangminh25 Posts: 65

    pls give Pathfinders sniper ability like in US campaign

  • #17
    1 year ago
    MSAF_Unbekannt_15MSAF_Unbe… Posts: 64
    edited July 2018

    US Recon Support Company 2.0
    Concept: Recon elements are a critical tool that no commander can operate effectively without. Lightly armoured scouting units can be deployed ahead of the Battalion, providing early reconnaissance and intelligence, allowing Airborne Divisions to deploy behind enemy lines and perform raiding operations. Observing enemy movement and displacement, Priest Howitzers and Butterfly Bombs can be deployed to provide artillery fire with surgical precision.

    [0CP]
    WC51 Truck

    • Same Truck as in Mechanized Company, comes with Mark Target, Step on It and 155mm Artillery.

    [2CP]
    I&R Pathfinder Paradrop

    • [230mp]
    • 3-man Pathfinder team equipped with 3x M1A1 Carbines and can be paradropped at any location on the map.
    • Armed with Paradrop-beacons, Signal Flares and 105 Artillery Flares.
    • Can reinforce from Paradrop-beacons.
    • Vet 1 increases squad size to 4 men and unlocks a Springfield for the 4th member.
    • Vet 1 unlocks “Marksman” ability in which the Springfield Pathfinder model will fire a single shot for 80 damage with 100% accuracy, killing any infantry squad that is targeted for 45 munitions. [Identical to Assassinate in Ardennes Assault].

    [3CP]
    Paratrooper Paradrop

    • [400mp]
    • 6-man Paratrooper team equipped with 6x M1A1 Carbines can be paradropped at any location on the map.
    • Upgrades include 4x Thompsons + Tactical Assault, 2x M1919A1 LMGs + Suppressing Fire, 2x M9 Bazooka + Ambush Camouflage
    • Cost increased from 380mp to 400mp because this ability essentially gives you the ability to either use vanilla Paratrooper (Which can be armed with 4x Thompsons or M1919A1 LMGs) or the Paratrooper Support Squad (Which can be armed with M9 Bazookas and gain Ambush Camouflage in the current patch)
    • No change to reinforce cost at 28mp.

    [7CP]
    M83 Cluster Bombing

    • Butterfly Bombs can be dropped on the enemy, effective against enemy infantry and stuns enemy armour.
    • No change from current patch.

    [9CP]
    M7B1 Priest Howitzer

    • M7B1 Self-Propelled Howitzer Chassis can be called into battle.
    • No change from current patch.

    This Commander reflects the direct synergy between Mechanized Recon, Airborne Infantry and Artillery fire. Unlike the Airborne Commander that relies on air superiority and increased support weapon availability, this commander ability pool is designed for a multitude of situations and works well with the theme of Recon Support.

    1. WC51 Truck.

    • Excellent Sight range, very mobile, fastest unit in the game, can deploy recon plane with Mark Target and call artillery. Feels right at home with this Company.

    2. I&R Pathfinder Paradrop

    • People have always wanted I&R Pathfinders and normal Pathfinders to spawn in buildings. This build-up offers the player a cheaper way to deploy I&R Pathfinders. They deploy as 3-man squads first and are directly responsible for recon and placing beacons for accurate paradrops and spotting enemies through the FoW behind enemy lines. As they vet up, they gain doctrinal counter-sniper capability and increase their squad size to the normal 4.

    3. Paratroopers Paradrop

    • Paratroopers are elite infantry that have two variants. Paratrooper squad (with Thompsons and LMG1919) and Paratrooper Support Squad (With M9 Bazooka + Camouflage and LMG1919). My suggestion would be to put both these units together into the original Paratrooper unit and increasing the cost to 400mp while still retaining 28mp reinforcement costs.

    • A noteworthy comparison is the Ranger which costs 400mp as well and deploys only from the base sector. While Rangers can be equipped with Thompsons and Bazookas, they cost 32mp to reinforce and that is because of their 0.8 received accuracy modifier. Paratroopers do not have this trait. This is why Paratroopers still retain 28mp reinforcement costs despite costing as much as Rangers in this design build.

    4. M83 Cluster Bombing

    • M83 Cluster bombing has several utilities. They are able to deliver potent Anti-infantry payloads. They are also capable of stunning tanks with temporary engine damage when hit by butterfly bombs. This can synergise with Priest Artillery Shells and with recon tools and units, especially when using this ability to cut-off an enemy's retreat path.

    5. Priest Howitzer

    • Expensive Howitzer artillery piece that can serve as a late-game option for shelling enemy strongpoints with intelligence gathered by forward recon units. Again, feels right at home with this Company.
  • #18
    1 year ago
    VATSVATS Posts: 15

    Infantry Company

    [0СP]
    (Passive) Riflemen Field Defenses.
    Riflemen are trained to build Fighting Positions, lay sandbags for cover, and plant mines.

    [2CP]
    Man the Defences.
    Infantry in cover will receive defensive bonuses for a short duration on target friendly sector.

    • Cost 75 munitions, 25 seconds duration.

    [4CP]
    Reconnaissance Overflight.
    A plane will fly over the designated area for a small period of time, revealing all enemy units and terrain near the location.

    • Cost 60 munitions.

    [5CP]
    Call-in Mechanized cavalry rifleman group on M3.

    • Cost 540 manpower and 30 fuel.
    • Cavalry rifleman squad armed with Thompson Submachine guns.
    • M3 has ability "Field Maintenance" for repair nearby units.
    • Cost 60 munitions to upgrade.

    [9CP]
    Call-in M7B1 Priest unit.
    "The M7B1 'Priest' uses the proven Sherman tank chassis mounting a 105mm howitzer for
    long range artillery barrages capable of damaging or destroying almost any kind of target.

    • Cost 480 manpower and 115 fuel.

    Infantry Company
    The core of every infantry company is a good combination of attack, defence and support capabilites. Riflemen Field Defenses allow USF infantry being "real" infantry that can construct light cover for establishing the front and Man the Defences ability will help to repel any heavy infantry assault on core sectors. Then, when the attack ended, Recon Overflight will provide a vision on enemy positions for preparing the counterattack. The Cavalry Riflemen on M3 with the M7B1 "Priest" arillery will move on the positions to suppress remained enemy resistance.

  • #19
    1 year ago
    VATSVATS Posts: 15

    Rifle Company

    [0CP]
    (Passive)
    Flamethrowers for Rear Echelon squad.

    • Cost 60 munitions to upgrade.

    [2CP]
    (Passive)
    Flares for Rifleman Squads.

    • Cost 30 munitions to use.

    [3CP]
    Call-in Sniper unit.

    • Cost 360 manpower.

    [3CP]
    (Passive)
    M1 Carbine upgrade for Rifleman Squad.

    • 5 rifles for 80 munitions.
    • Adds "Suppressive fire" ability for 20 munitions.

    [7CP]
    (Passive)
    Phosphorus barrage for 81-mm Mortar Squads and M8A1 howitzer motor carriage.

    • Cost 45 munitions to use.

    Rifle Company
    As previously said USF has variety of "instruments" to dealing with any threat on the frontline. Additional weaponry for Rear Echelon and Rifleman squad will slightly change their purpose, allowing Riflemans to suppress any infantry targets when Rear Echelon squads will burn them with the flamethrowers. If they engage a heavy fortified positions, Sniper and Phosphorus charges will provide cover for engaging units.

  • #20
    1 year ago
    VegnaVegna Posts: 957

    Reminder that all proposed changes, must be preexisting units or abilities currently in the live game.

  • #21
    1 year ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    @Vegna When you say "live game", does that include campaigns and theater of war? Lots of cool units and abilities there that don't appear in skirmish.

  • #22
    1 year ago

    Airborne Company 2.0
    Concept: No change

    [0CP]
    Medical Supply Crates

    • 3x Medical Supply Crates can be paradropped to a target location. [30 munitions]
    • Same as Ostheer and British Variants

    [1CP]
    Pathfinder Paradrop

    • [230mp]
    • 3-man Pathfinder team equipped with 3x M1A1 Carbines and can be paradropped at any location on the map.
    • Armed with Paradrop-beacons, Signal Flares and 105 Artillery Flares.
    • Can reinforce from Paradrop-beacons.
    • Vet 1 increases squad size to 4 men and unlocks a Springfield for the 4th member.
    • Vet 1 unlocks “Marksman” ability in which the Springfield Pathfinder model will fire a single shot for 80 damage with 100% accuracy, killing any infantry squad that is targeted for 45 munitions. [Identical to Assassinate in Ardennes Assault].
    • Vet 2 unlocks 2nd Springfield Rifle

    [3CP]
    Paratrooper Paradrop

    • [400mp]
    • 6-man Paratrooper team equipped with 6x M1A1 Carbines can be paradropped at any location on the map.
    • Upgrades include 4x Thompsons + Tactical Assault, 2x M1919A1 LMGs + Suppressing Fire, 2x M9 Bazooka + Ambush Camouflage
    • Cost increased from 380mp to 400mp because this ability essentially gives you the ability to either use vanilla - Paratrooper (Which can be armed with 4x Thompsons or M1919A1 LMGs) or the Paratrooper Support Squad (Which can be armed with M9 Bazookas and gain Ambush Camouflage in the current patch)
    • No change to reinforce cost at 28mp.

    [4CP]
    Resupply Operation

    • [70 munitions]
    • Airdropped M2HB 50.cal Machine Gun and 57mm AT gun at a target location.

    [12CP]
    Rocket Strafing Run

    • Thunderbolt Strafing Run, no change from current commander.

    I do have alternative build-ups for this commander but this is the first draft I could think of that would directly improve the effectiveness of paradrop call-ins by combining M2HB 50.cal and 57mm AT gun as a single drop using munitions. Medical Supply Crates can also increase the effectiveness of Infantry Squads and allow them to heal quickly and can also be used to support teammates in team-games.

  • #23
    1 year ago
    VegnaVegna Posts: 957

    @PanzerFutz said:
    @Vegna When you say "live game", does that include campaigns and theater of war? Lots of cool units and abilities there that don't appear in skirmish.

    It's what is in the original post. If it's not already in the game then not going to be added. Odds are will need to be in multiplayer as that's where it's balanced.

  • #24
    1 year ago
    @Vegna @PanzerFutz By definition that also means units in the main campaign and Ardennes Assault. So yes, it does include exclusive assets in campaigns and ToW missions.
  • #25
    1 year ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    @Vegna If it's limited to only what's in the skirmish modes, there are going to be a lot of contributors to these threads who are going to be mighty disappointed. Very few suggestions have stuck to the strict interpretation of the guidelines.

    @MSAF_Unbekannt_15 Your version of the Airborne Company makes a lot more sense than the current version. Taking up 2 slots for weapons really limits what can be done with the US Airborne. Medical Supplies is the obvious missing element. I'd like to see them fix that too. I'd really like to see your version of Pathfinders - paradrop + marksman upgrade are so necessary. I hope we see that change.

  • #26
    1 year ago
    VegnaVegna Posts: 957

    @PanzerFutz of course they will be disappointment, many clearly haven't read the OP and have then got their hopes on something which isn't practical.

  • #27
    1 year ago
    MSAF_Unbekannt_15MSAF_Unbe… Posts: 64
    edited August 2018
    @Vegna To be honest, so long as the article in question is a game asset that exists as part of the core game made by the developers. (Including assets from released content like Campaigns and Theatre of War) it can still be considered because this thread also addresses ideas for newer commanders using those assets available in the core game already. These include assets in the gamefiles but not in the current patch.

    Things that do not count as core game assets include modded models and items that do not exist in the game as of the current patch.
  • #28
    1 year ago
    AntiFascistWarriorAntiFasci… Sydney, AustraliaPosts: 9

    I think that developers should swap M8 Greyhound and M10 Tank Destroyer for M20 Utility Car and M36 Tank Destroyer, which means that M8 and M10 can be trained, while M20 and M36 become special units for a commander to dispatch, since in the WW2 M8 and M10 are overwholmingly productive than M20 and M36.

  • #29
    1 year ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    @FrankCortez I gotta tell ya, this game ain't that big on historical accuracy.

    I think the reason for those choices might be that a) the standard M4A3 (with a 75 mm L/40 gun) is pretty weak against other factions' armour so, the M36 (with a 90 mm L/53 gun) is needed to balance this; and, b) no one would use the M20 if the M8 were part of the core force.

    The US faction relies on the M36 to counter other factions' armour and the M10 is really just a cheaper, doctrinal alternative. Neither of them come with a .50cal upgrade so, they're pretty weak against infantry. The M4A3 is much better against infantry than against medium or heavy tanks so, when playing the US, you really need a mixed armoured force. You can't rely on one type of tank the way the Germans can.

    The M20 is just an anomaly. In the game, it's a handy infantry counter early, when there are few AT counters, but it struggles later and it's really only useful if you've got a commander with Raid tactics. In real life, it was a cheap armoured car, brought in because, the M8 was already so out-classed it didn't really matter if it had no main gun. If either of them ran into anything other than infantry, they were both equally in danger.

    In real life, the M8's canister shot was devastating. In the game, it's pretty crap because, it won't target a unit and track it until it fires. It just fires at a spot on the map and usually misses. I've seen AT rounds curve in flight tracking a moving target but, they can't bring themselves to have the M8 track an infantry unit and plaster it with ball bearings.

    As I said, not big on accuracy.

  • #30
    1 year ago
    MSAF_Unbekannt_15MSAF_Unbe… Posts: 64
    edited August 2018
    @PanzerFutz Can't go wrong with the M20's mine ability. 100% chance of destroying treads, 1 hit kills any light vehicle [Panzer IIs, Pumas, etc.] and does as much damage as a teller mine... Far from useless. It's essentially a game over for Heavy tanks if they get hit by that thing. [Pre-patch, these things would 1 hit kill a Tiger Ace with a demo charge on top of it.]
  • #31
    1 year ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    While the mines themselves are pretty good, the way they're laid is unrealistic. The M20 rolls up and drops the mine, like it's taking a dump. If it were realistic, the crew would have to leave the vehicle and lay the mine by hand, the same way infantry units do. It would take a little bit longer and both crew & vehicle would be vulnerable during the operation but, that's what they'd have to do in real life.

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