USF - New Commander Mod Official Discussion

#1
8 months ago
Andy_REAndy_RE Posts: 270 admin

Hey all,

Please use this thread to discuss the New Commander Mod and provide any feedback you have in relation to the USF.

Current version notes, and instructions for how to play the mod are here: http://www.companyofheroes.com/blog/2019/03/19/new-commander-update-commander-rosters-and-test-mod

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Comments

  • #2
    8 months ago
    MartevallMartevall Posts: 108
    You did all great job , now It's my time to test them :smiley:
  • #3
    8 months ago
    BazookaDreBazookaDre Posts: 31
    edited March 20

    Noticed a few things while using the new commander.

    Bugs:

    • Sherman Veterancy is broken after getting the dozer. Radio Net for example only shows up at Vet 3

    Comments:

    • The Rifle grenades are interesting and will need more testing from me, but they do work nicely. Animation is kind of awkward though.
  • #4
    8 months ago
    mognatsmognats Posts: 6

    Gave it a good test. I think the commander works but needs adjustments in a couple areas. I think the Rifle Nade should go to rifleman to make it less spammable. And make rifleman a little bit more useful instead of stalling until cp 3 to get rangers.

    The sherman dozer feels like a wasted spot and should be changed with a different upgrade of sorts.

    The Calliope still comes out way too late and does not do nearly enough for the stage of the game it comes out. Either make it a major unit that must be constructed (with buffs, fire more rockets and faster) or make it come out much earlier.

  • #5
    8 months ago
    • USF - Urban Assault
      Rifle Grenades will probably be of limited use, as most players prefer to give REs bazookas to be decent AT infantry, but still a good alternative and a way to use an ability that was probably almost never used in most cases. Rangers are a decent infantry, but I hope the 50mp cheaper doesnt lead to spam. The Calliope may want to be a little more expensive as it is to my knowledge the only heavily armored mobile rocket artillery in the game. Otherwise, it seems fine to me.
  • #6
    8 months ago
    MartevallMartevall Posts: 108
    > @mognats said:
    > The sherman dozer feels like a wasted spot and should be changed with a different upgrade of sorts.

    In my opinion reserve armor abillity will be more usefull because there is also a Sherman dozer but you have additional Sherman (76) which is great at tank in mid game
  • #7
    8 months ago

    USF - Urban Assault

    [Rear Echelon Rifle Grenades]

    Can be upgraded with Rifle Grenades as one of this commanders slot abilities.
    Requires 60 munitions; locks out minesweepers
    AOE distance 0.5/1.5/4 versus 1/2/3 of the standard Fighting Pit.
    AOE damage 1/0.5/0.3 versus 1/0.75/0.25 of the standard Fighting Pit.
    Range 35, 20 minimum.

    -only one thing useful in this commander

    Dozer Blades

    M4 Sherman Tanks can now be upgraded with Dozer Blades; same as Mechanized Company.

    -> waste slot, stop put this fooking trash skill

    No one use this and even Top USF player dont use this skill

    Rangers

    Reinforce cost from 33 to 32
    Cost from 400 to 350

    -> cost decrease is good, but ranger need more utility skill(sachel or anything else)

    Ranger is a unit that was made in a hurry without enough thinking(model, voice,concept....)

    Calliope

    Far AOE damage from 0.15 to 0.25
    Cost from 380/140 to 380/115

    -> Most problem of calliope is "cant kill anything" because barrage speed is too slow and small AOE(4)

    this is not buff and no one will use

    I dont think so USF need "urban assault"

    USF need more ez8 or pershing commander and should get more air support skills

  • #8
    8 months ago
    MartevallMartevall Posts: 108
    > @HyperBlancat said:
    > USF - Urban Assault
    >
    > [Rear Echelon Rifle Grenades]
    >
    > Can be upgraded with Rifle Grenades as one of this commanders slot abilities.
    > Requires 60 munitions; locks out minesweepers
    > AOE distance 0.5/1.5/4 versus 1/2/3 of the standard Fighting Pit.
    > AOE damage 1/0.5/0.3 versus 1/0.75/0.25 of the standard Fighting Pit.
    > Range 35, 20 minimum.
    >
    > -only one thing useful in this commander
    >
    > Dozer Blades
    >
    > M4 Sherman Tanks can now be upgraded with Dozer Blades; same as Mechanized Company.
    >
    > -> waste slot, stop put this fooking trash skill
    >
    > No one use this and even Top USF player dont use this skill
    >
    > Rangers
    >
    > Reinforce cost from 33 to 32
    > Cost from 400 to 350
    >
    > -> cost decrease is good, but ranger need more utility skill(sachel or anything else)
    >
    > Ranger is a unit that was made in a hurry without enough thinking(model, voice,concept....)
    >
    > Calliope
    >
    > Far AOE damage from 0.15 to 0.25
    > Cost from 380/140 to 380/115
    >
    > -> Most problem of calliope is "cant kill anything" because barrage speed is too slow and small AOE(4)
    >
    > this is not buff and no one will use
    >
    > I dont think so USF need "urban assault"
    >
    > USF need more ez8 or pershing commander and should get more air support skills

    I can agree with you only in Sherman dozer i think it should be changed to " Reserved armor " from mechanized company or M4A3E8 " easy eight"
  • #9
    8 months ago
    BazookaDreBazookaDre Posts: 31

    While I agree wholeheartedly that a dozer only skill feels like its only half an upgrade, we do need to keep to the Urban Assault theme. I see what they wanted to do, a Dozer Sherman is as tough as an Easy Eight defensively after the upgrade while retaining the standard Sherman's HE round which is excellent in Urban settings. I don't believe they wanted this commander to be another armor focused commander. Otherwise, I'd so lean towards Easy Eight. Which the unit itself needs a look at anyways. However, on the same token, do we desire it because it fits this company or because Rifle company is sort of crap right now?

  • #10
    8 months ago
    SerpentSerpent Posts: 7

    i tested that commander and i must say that dozer as a solo abillity hasn't any sense . yoy schould give him "reserve armor " abillity to be more useful and practical

  • #11
    8 months ago
    mognatsmognats Posts: 6

    @HyperBlancat said:
    USF - Urban Assault

    [Rear Echelon Rifle Grenades]

    Can be upgraded with Rifle Grenades as one of this commanders slot abilities.
    Requires 60 munitions; locks out minesweepers
    AOE distance 0.5/1.5/4 versus 1/2/3 of the standard Fighting Pit.
    AOE damage 1/0.5/0.3 versus 1/0.75/0.25 of the standard Fighting Pit.
    Range 35, 20 minimum.

    -only one thing useful in this commander

    Dozer Blades

    M4 Sherman Tanks can now be upgraded with Dozer Blades; same as Mechanized Company.

    -> waste slot, stop put this fooking trash skill

    No one use this and even Top USF player dont use this skill

    Rangers

    Reinforce cost from 33 to 32
    Cost from 400 to 350

    -> cost decrease is good, but ranger need more utility skill(sachel or anything else)

    Ranger is a unit that was made in a hurry without enough thinking(model, voice,concept....)

    Calliope

    Far AOE damage from 0.15 to 0.25
    Cost from 380/140 to 380/115

    -> Most problem of calliope is "cant kill anything" because barrage speed is too slow and small AOE(4)

    this is not buff and no one will use

    I dont think so USF need "urban assault"

    USF need more ez8 or pershing commander and should get more air support skills

    Definitely throwning in EZ8 and a satchel on rangers would be HUGE. Calliope is in major need of changes as I said before, it would be best to be a unit that just gets built (similar to the m10) and it needs plenty of damage buffs. Every faction has nondoctrinal rocket arty so the USF should be able to at least build theirs around the same time.

    So all in all.

    RE Nades go to rifleman and take up one weapon slot.
    Rangers maybe go to CP2 but definitely get satchels
    Smoke can stay
    EZ8 (build at major plus a few buffs against infantry)
    Calliope (build at major and more rockets and more damage)

  • #12
    8 months ago
    MartevallMartevall Posts: 108
    > @mognats said:
    > @HyperBlancat said:
    > USF - Urban Assault
    >
    > [Rear Echelon Rifle Grenades]
    >
    > Can be upgraded with Rifle Grenades as one of this commanders slot abilities.
    > Requires 60 munitions; locks out minesweepers
    > AOE distance 0.5/1.5/4 versus 1/2/3 of the standard Fighting Pit.
    > AOE damage 1/0.5/0.3 versus 1/0.75/0.25 of the standard Fighting Pit.
    > Range 35, 20 minimum.
    >
    > -only one thing useful in this commander
    >
    > Dozer Blades
    >
    > M4 Sherman Tanks can now be upgraded with Dozer Blades; same as Mechanized Company.
    >
    > -> waste slot, stop put this fooking trash skill
    >
    > No one use this and even Top USF player dont use this skill
    >
    > Rangers
    >
    > Reinforce cost from 33 to 32
    > Cost from 400 to 350
    >
    > -> cost decrease is good, but ranger need more utility skill(sachel or anything else)
    >
    > Ranger is a unit that was made in a hurry without enough thinking(model, voice,concept....)
    >
    > Calliope
    >
    > Far AOE damage from 0.15 to 0.25
    > Cost from 380/140 to 380/115
    >
    > -> Most problem of calliope is "cant kill anything" because barrage speed is too slow and small AOE(4)
    >
    > this is not buff and no one will use
    >
    > I dont think so USF need "urban assault"
    >
    > USF need more ez8 or pershing commander and should get more air support skills
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Definitely throwning in EZ8 and a satchel on rangers would be HUGE. Calliope is in major need of changes as I said before, it would be best to be a unit that just gets built (similar to the m10) and it needs plenty of damage buffs. Every faction has nondoctrinal rocket arty so the USF should be able to at least build theirs around the same time.
    >
    > So all in all.
    >
    > RE Nades go to rifleman and take up one weapon slot.
    > Rangers maybe go to CP2 but definitely get satchels
    > Smoke can stay
    > EZ8 (build at major plus a few buffs against infantry)
    > Calliope (build at major and more rockets and more damage)

    Definetely YES
  • #13
    8 months ago
    maxhewittmaxhewitt East Sussex, United KingdomPosts: 6

    For me, the urban assault doctrine should be the following:

    1. Unlock flamer upgrade for RE and Rifle grenade for Riflemen.
    2. Call-in Rangers with bazookas upgrade option
    3. Replace smoke with 'Raid' ability from UKF
    4. Call-in Howitzer Sherman with dozer built-on
    5. Call-in Calliope with longer range.
  • #14
    8 months ago
    RomanovRomanov Posts: 48
    edited March 21

    After some testing i would say that for me at least the bulldozer blade and riflegrenade are the weakest element of this doctrine.the bulldozer blade alone is not worth it without the 76mm sherman or the 105mm gun and the riflegrenades do a pathetic amount of damage while robbing you of not only a rifle but also the sweepers.

    i would propose giving the REs a 'Combat support package' that grants them 2-3 riflemen garands in addition to the grenade launcher garand that together take up 1 weapon slot to further empathize this role of ranged combat support.

    the smoke barrage is simple and straigthforward, the calliope will surely be a welcome add-on aswell.

    I like the cost decrease for rangers but like pretty much all elite infantry they dont compare to Stock riflemen in terms of cost-effectiveness and versitility. they need to bring something new to the table, like Assault engineers flamethrower and support ability or paratroopers that can upgrade double .30cal and reinforce near beacons, not to mention their concentrated fire ability with the thompsons. I would propose a WP grenade like the british have, but with a delay like volks flame nade. Another pretty unique thing i thought about was 'thermite charge' ability that you could use on abandoned crew weapons or vehicles to destroy them for about 30-45 munitions.

  • #15
    8 months ago
    Dozgerblade alone seems quite medicore. Adding the 76 sherman like the mechanized or Ex8 seems more viable.
  • #16
    8 months ago
    Aiborne82Aiborne82 Posts: 17

    If they are trying to make this an Urban assault commander the dozer blade is a waste of space. Either bring in some kind of reinforcement halftrack or give some use to the slot by adding the 105mm dozer blade Sherman

  • #17
    8 months ago
    MartevallMartevall Posts: 108
    The best choice will be to give Sherman (76) on the place with dozer
  • #18
    8 months ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822
    Enjoyed the commander.
    Didn't end up using rangers because I was pop capped out due to going 3 free officers and an AT GUN and 50 cal. But they were good before and I don't imagine making them cheaper hurt that any.... Especially with how durable they are. Perfect killing machines them.

    I like the dozer blades and think it's and under rated ability. Being able to throw up green cover so easily is really handy late game. Plus everyone whines about how squishy Sherman's are and here's an ability to up armour them and they bitch its not another tank.... Anyways

    The rifle grenade--lots of fun. Keeps the enemy on their toes!
    POSSIBLE BUG
    I put my RE in a pit and when I took em out they had the upgrade. Not sure if I just forgot to upgrade them or a bug. Sorry not clear

    Calliope... It's vet requirements are too bloody high. I had a few vehicle kils and over 50 infantry kills and it was only half way to 3. Maybe let it get the dozer blade too if you can just so it has something to do in the cooldown? It's got such a high pop cap for all that down time.

    Smoke off map is good.
  • #19
    7 months ago
    SerpentSerpent Posts: 7

    okey then , so it's my opinion about commander:

    RERG- is very interesting , it could be a bit more better if you will give RERG to rifle squad , anyway it can stay

    smoke- not much to speak here , great buff will make it better

    dozer blades- ...... em okey i know it can make green cover etc but seriously this is the biggest skill slot waste i've ever seen, please replace that with more usefull abillity like "reserve armor" it has dozer too but also you have acces to sherman (76)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    rangers-after some buffs and testing it i think rangers are ballanced and i think they can stay

    calliope- again the buff is great , i don't know why people have problem with that , only i see is calliope can do much more job here

  • #20
    7 months ago

    @Serpent said:
    okey then , so it's my opinion about commander:

    RERG- is very interesting , it could be a bit more better if you will give RERG to rifle squad , anyway it can stay

    smoke- not much to speak here , great buff will make it better

    dozer blades- ...... em okey i know it can make green cover etc but seriously this is the biggest skill slot waste i've ever seen, please replace that with more usefull abillity like "reserve armor" it has dozer too but also you have acces to sherman (76)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    rangers-after some buffs and testing it i think rangers are ballanced and i think they can stay

    calliope- again the buff is great , i don't know why people have problem with that , only i see is calliope can do much more job here

    because small AOE(4) and slow barrage speed cant kill anything

  • #21
    7 months ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822
    > @HyperBlancat said:
    > @Serpent said:
    > okey then , so it's my opinion about commander:
    >
    > RERG- is very interesting , it could be a bit more better if you will give RERG to rifle squad , anyway it can stay
    >
    > smoke- not much to speak here , great buff will make it better
    >
    > dozer blades- ...... em okey i know it can make green cover etc but seriously this is the biggest skill slot waste i've ever seen, please replace that with more usefull abillity like "reserve armor" it has dozer too but also you have acces to sherman (76)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    >
    > rangers-after some buffs and testing it i think rangers are ballanced and i think they can stay
    >
    > calliope- again the buff is great , i don't know why people have problem with that , only i see is calliope can do much more job here
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > because small AOE(4) and slow barrage speed cant kill anything

    What's the aoe of the Katy? Cause now the calliope is only 30 fuel more with way more health and armour. If the aoe is similar that's not unreasonable.
  • #22
    7 months ago
    MartevallMartevall Posts: 108
    Replace dozer blades with "reserve armor " or Sherman 'east eight' please
  • #23
    7 months ago
    Lnk003Lnk003 Posts: 418
    edited March 25

    A bit funny to see RE rifle nade get a fuse when the grenadiers' one doesn't and is like probably the only one in the game not to have a fuse time. Even in live game, grenades that have about the same throw range and lengthy animations like rangers' one still have fuse. Like grens' nade is that weird exception for no reason.
    Anyway the RN being spammed automaticaly by RE once upgraded just makes the thing more annoying. More dodgable at the same time by mobile units but still very strong against static/slow tagets like MGs and that's with the fuse.
    It would be about time that Grens rifle nade gets a fuse because it's the same rationale than RE's getting one.

    You could also make the rifle nade upgrade free so it could just replace the smoke ability and cost the same to use.

  • #24
    7 months ago
    WAAAGH2000WAAAGH2000 Posts: 87

    Dozer Blades it`s jooooooooooooke!!!!DO NOT PUT THIS PLZ!

  • #25
    7 months ago
    AzurewrathAzurewrath Posts: 11

    Dozer blade alone taking a ability slot? Mechanized company already has Reserve Armor, which includes dozer blade AND unlocks 76mm Sherman. This ability needs to be changed like Mechanized company or Include some other unit unlocks to be fair.

  • #26
    7 months ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822

    @Azurewrath said:
    Dozer blade alone taking a ability slot? Mechanized company already has Reserve Armor, which includes dozer blade AND unlocks 76mm Sherman. This ability needs to be changed like Mechanized company or Include some other unit unlocks to be fair.

    most abilities dont grant 15 things. the m42 AT gun takes an entire ability slot, ost mortar HT takes an entire slot itself, t34/85 is an entire slot.

    reserve armour was tuned to suit the commanders design of being armour focused. keep in in that the dozer increases the sherman durability (both armour and health) as well as being able to gum up pathing and create green cover for your troops.

    think of it as converting the sherman into an infantry support tank.

  • #27
    7 months ago
    > most abilities dont grant 15 things. the m42 AT gun takes an entire ability slot, ost mortar HT takes an entire slot itself, t34/85 is an entire slot.
    >
    > reserve armour was tuned to suit the commanders design of being armour focused. keep in in that the dozer increases the sherman durability (both armour and health) as well as being able to gum up pathing and create green cover for your troops.
    >
    > think of it as converting the sherman into an infantry support tank.

    I dont think making this slot just the ineferior version of mechanized armor is not the best option. T34/85 is a entire whole unit while the dozer is merely an upgrade. You can say it fits the concept of this commander but adding underwhelming skill for fluff wont make it viable. Dozers do provide sherman with survivability but in sacrifice of its mobility. It can be useful but it alone as a slot seems like a waste
  • #28
    7 months ago
    MartevallMartevall Posts: 108
    > @USFzaBESTno1 said:
    > > most abilities dont grant 15 things. the m42 AT gun takes an entire ability slot, ost mortar HT takes an entire slot itself, t34/85 is an entire slot.
    > >
    > > reserve armour was tuned to suit the commanders design of being armour focused. keep in in that the dozer increases the sherman durability (both armour and health) as well as being able to gum up pathing and create green cover for your troops.
    > >
    > > think of it as converting the sherman into an infantry support tank.
    >
    > I dont think making this slot just the ineferior version of mechanized armor is not the best option. T34/85 is a entire whole unit while the dozer is merely an upgrade. You can say it fits the concept of this commander but adding underwhelming skill for fluff wont make it viable. Dozers do provide sherman with survivability but in sacrifice of its mobility. It can be useful but it alone as a slot seems like a waste

    Definetely YES.
  • #29
    7 months ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    This is possibly the most disappointing of all the new commanders but, it could be fixed with with a couple of adjustments.

    Like other players, I find the Rifle-grenades underwhelming. They are good for long-range combat but, they don't help at short ranges. I agree with @maxhewitt - give the flamer to the RE's and the Rifle-grenades to the Riflemen. Call it an "Assault Package" and it will suit this doctrine much better.

    Again, like other players, I think the dozer blade is a waste of a slot. I think the 105 mm Sherman is the best fit, even though it becomes available much later. If not that, then Reserve Armor is better than just the blade by itself.

    Everything else is good. (I don't think the Calliope suits urban warfare but, it is still a pretty good weapon to have.)

  • #30
    7 months ago
    thedarkarmadillothedarkar… Posts: 5,822
    I'd sooner the 105 than reserve armour as I think the 76mm doesn't fit the commander at all, but then you lose the ability to fight p4s using your sherman by getting the 105. I know it's not flashy but I'm confused by players not liking an uparmoured up utilitized sherman. Sure it's slower but the idea is urban combat where the mobility is less important that raw staying power. What's more being able to block off roads! I don't get yall....
  • #31
    7 months ago
    PanzerFutzPanzerFutz Melbourne, OzPosts: 346

    @thedarkarmadillo If you could show me some evidence that the standard M4 with a dozer blade can go head-to-head with a Pz4 and not be out of its league, I might be convinced.

    I think the 105 is more suited to taking on garrisoned infantry than other tanks. However, it can build revetments for other tanks and TD's to give them a makeshift "hull-down" aspect.

    Everyone seems to agree that the dozer blade is perfect for urban warfare, it's just that a lot of us feel that it's not enough on its own. I'm not sure there is any solution which won't displease someone.

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