Commander Update Beta 2021 - Ostheer Feedback

#1
1 month ago
JohnT_REJohnT_RE CanadaPosts: 21 admin

Please post all feedback from the Commander Update beta for the Ostheer faction here.

«1

Comments

  • #2
    1 month ago
    yunusozgulyunusozgul Posts: 20

    Supply Drop Zone
    This ability lets the player possess either 150 Munitions or 50 Fuel at the cost of 200 Manpower, and the cargo planes that carry the supplies are invulnerable to anti-air. So, there's no other way to counter this ability except rushing into the supply drop area that is probably guarded by enemy troops. This ability becomes more attractive in the maps where either the Fuel point or the Munitions point is close to your base and easily be defended by some bunkers, etc. My suggestion is that there should be only one cargo plane that delivers the chosen supply, and It will be logically vulnerable to anti-air. Also, the cargo plane should fly over the opponent base just like the Allied Supply Drop ability so as to be countered by the opponent team.

    Sd.Kfz. 234 'Puma' Armored Car
    The ability to dispatch this vehicle is unlocked too late, which is why the Mobile Defense Doctrine commander isn't preferred by the community at the moment. For example, why should I pick this commander to dispatch this vehicle while I can play OKW and build it earlier? Therefore, the commander point requirement to unlock the ability might be lowered to 4 in order to reflect the vehicle's overall performance for its timing.

  • #3
    1 month ago
    Arcturus64Arcturus64 Posts: 10

    In the Commander Spreadsheet, it is NOT indicated by an arrow that the Storm Doctrine got the Rigel mine changed with Jaeger Command Squad.

  • #4
    1 month ago

    I wish the OKW pz4 would be completely removed from OStheer i think it is useless because you could get it by saving your regular pz4 und collecting veterancy. furthermore i think it is unbalanced, that the okw pz4 needs 14 space in your army while your Ostheer pz4 with needed veterancy to be the okw pz4 still only needs 12 space.

  • #5
    1 month ago
    Arcturus64Arcturus64 Posts: 10

    Luftwaffe Officer Stuka Suppression Run doesn't supress, neither does the Stuka Anti Infanry Strafe:

  • #6
    1 month ago
    YappirYappir Posts: 87

    I would like to point out that "blitzkrieg doctrine" and "mobile defense doctrine" are somewhat over-looked.
    I made posts about this:
    Mobile defence
    Blitzkrieg

  • #7
    1 month ago
    TobbacosTobbacos Posts: 35

    Soviet Bunker missing

  • #8
    1 month ago
    Aiborne82Aiborne82 Posts: 21

    I really like the Whermacht changes so far. They seem decent. I think the Opel Blitz supply truck should be added in place of the OKW PZIV in their respective commanders in order to keep the Whermacht line up unique. We already have a Panzer IV.

  • #9
    1 month ago
    KiethSomataw99KiethSoma… Posts: 105

    My suggestion to the Tiger (the regular one), one I've been insisting on in addition to the current changes:

    To make its requirements more in line with heavy tanks of other factions, while the Tiger's requirements are slightly lower than the Tiger Ace or the Elefant.

    In addition to Battle Phase 3, the Tiger call in requires either a Heavy Panzer Korps or a Support Armor Korps to be built.

    This should make sense as while it's more in line with most other heavy tanks, many players tend to have versatile medium armor production up by the time they get enough CP.

    Also, for Panzergrenadiers:

    In addition to Battle Phase 1, they require an Infanterie Kompanie or a Leichte Mechanized Kompanie to be built. They are still called in from the Kampfgruppe Headquarters.

  • #10
    1 month ago
    TheDeedleTheDeedle Posts: 2

    After using the 'Luftwaffe supply doctrine' for a fair little bit, I have some observations.
    This doctrine should not have its Supply Drop Zone ability replaced with the Supply drop ability. As the rest of the doctrine has fairly powerful abilities, this doctrine doesn't also need the ability to near instantly get an MG and pak40 along with the fuel/munitions
    Notes:
    The strafe used by the Luftwaffe officer doesn't cause any suppression
    The Heavy bombing costs 300 munitions and not 250 like the patch notes say

  • #11
    1 month ago
    yunusozgulyunusozgul Posts: 20
    edited April 4

    @TheDeedle said:
    After using the 'Luftwaffe supply doctrine' for a fair little bit, I have some observations.
    This doctrine should not have its Supply Drop Zone ability replaced with the Supply drop ability. As the rest of the doctrine has fairly powerful abilities, this doctrine doesn't also need the ability to near instantly get an MG and pak40 along with the fuel/munitions
    Notes:
    The strafe used by the Luftwaffe officer doesn't cause any suppression
    The Heavy bombing costs 300 munitions and not 250 like the patch notes say

    The Supply Drop Zone ability can't be countered in no circumstances, which is both illogical and unbalanced. That's why either it should be balanced somehow or entirely removed from the game.

    On the other hand, the Luftwaffe Officer shouldn't be able to call for an aerial smoke drop for free. In the current patch, the Smoke Bombs ability that is available for Storm Doctrine, German Mechanized Doctrine and Festung Support Doctrine costs only 40 Munitions, which is a bit cheaper than the other reconnaissance abilities like Reconnaissance Overflight. The ability itself also gives a quick vision and recharges so rapidly that can be used so often in-game. Therefore, it shouldn't be a free ability so as to restore the balance.

    Edit: I confused the new ability with the one that is currently available for the commanders above and misread the patch notes for some reason, so I apologize for the misunderstanding.

  • #12
    1 month ago
    Ver1tasCVer1tasC Posts: 14

    @yunusozgul said:

    On the other hand, the Luftwaffe Officer shouldn't be able to call for an aerial smoke drop for free. In the current patch, the Smoke Bombs ability that is available for Storm Doctrine, German Mechanized Doctrine and Festung Support Doctrine costs only 40 Munitions, which is a bit cheaper than the other reconnaissance abilities like Reconnaissance Overflight. The ability itself also gives a quick vision and recharges so rapidly that can be used so often in-game. Therefore, it shouldn't be a free ability so as to restore the balance.

    I bet you did not even read the beta changes carefully, did you? The Smoke ability from the Luftwaffe Officer will not give vision like other recon abilities. It just drops smoke.

    Smoke artillery barrage replaced with Stuka Smoke Drop; grants no line of sight but has no munitions cost.

  • #13
    1 month ago
    TheDeedleTheDeedle Posts: 2

    @yunusozgul said:
    The Supply Drop Zone ability can't be countered in no circumstances, which is both illogical and unbalanced. That's why either it should be balanced somehow or entirely removed from the game.

    The same can be said for the supply drop ability plus being able to instantly get 2 good team weapons on the field for just the price of a couple squads.

    On the other hand, the Luftwaffe Officer shouldn't be able to call for an aerial smoke drop for free. In the current patch, the Smoke Bombs ability that is available for Storm Doctrine, German Mechanized Doctrine and Festung Support Doctrine costs only 40 Munitions, which is a bit cheaper than the other reconnaissance abilities like Reconnaissance Overflight. The ability itself also gives a quick vision and recharges so rapidly that can be used so often in-game. Therefore, it shouldn't be a free ability so as to restore the balance.

    You didn't read the patch notes in their entirety did you, the plane provides zero vision, making the ability a very elaborate smoke grenade

  • #14
    1 month ago
    AlexPayneAlexPayne Posts: 1
    edited April 3

    Hello,

    Festung Armor Doctrine's Panzer 4 J don't have smoke while the commander have Panzer Tactician.!

  • #15
    1 month ago
    VipperVipper Posts: 3,747
    edited April 6

    251 Mobile Observation Post

    Suggestions:
    Replace unit with call in or built from T2 to unable spiking T2
    Lower flare to match infatry mortar flare to 30-35

    Assault and Hold

    Suggestions:
    move to another commander, commander already offer superior infatry

    Artillery Field Officer

    Suggestions:
    Reduce reinforcement time
    Add 1-2 ST44 with vet
    Consider adding different types of officers:
    Panzer officer, infatry officer, artillery officer, Luft officer

    Breakthrough

    Suggestions:
    Add to more commanders

    Command Panzer IV

    Suggestions:
    Lower XP value
    Lower Pop to 10
    Make custom made vet bonuses
    Either change the gun to be similar to Stug-E and have AI/AT or increase penetration of gun so the unit can fight enemy light tanks

    Concrete Bunker

    Suggestions:
    Add damage reduction/durability or "brace"
    Create a new type as FRP that can force and air drop medical kits.

    Counter Attack Tactics

    Suggestions:

    Forward Resupply Station

    Suggestions:
    set building HP to set amount 75-100%
    Make aura a timed ability
    Add the FRP bunker
    reduce enginner to 4 lower price to 20 FU

    Grenadier Jeager Light Infantry Package

    Suggestions:
    Replace the ability with a new squad similar to Command JLI
    5 entities 2 G43 static camo interrogation.

    Hulldown

    Suggestions:
    Rename defensive position
    Casemate now cloak and rotate faster

    JU-87 Suppression Loiter

    Suggestions:

    Luftwaffe Field Officer

    Suggestions:
    Replace MP-40 with K98 since abilities have longer range
    Add a MP-44 with vet

    Mortar Halftrack Incendiary

    Suggestions:
    increase CD of Incendiary barrage
    reduce scatter

    Osttruppen

    Suggestions:
    Target size to 1
    now have target size penalty 1.25 when in cover as squad ability
    Scarp LMG
    With BP 3 can upgrade so weapon work as if in cover and all bonus/penalties in cover are removed

    Panzer Grenadier Support Package

    Suggestions:
    make it for free and not an upgrade

    Panzer Tactician

    Suggestions:

    Puma

    Suggestions:

    Relief Infantry

    Suggestions:
    build time/reinforcement bonus reduce 10% now passive at CP 2
    Ability give a Support unit that can merge but not reinforce

    Sector Artillery

    Suggestions:
    Defensive abilities should become cheaper available earlier and be less potent
    Now targets a Single sector
    artillery now reduced to light artillery barrage level
    CP and Price down

    Stormtroopers

    Suggestions:
    Now start a 5 men MP-40 DPs reduces for Lower total DPS

    Strategic Bombing Run

    Suggestions:
    Commander already has incendiary bombs

    StuG E

    Suggestions:
    Replace vet 1 ability that has 40 damage...allow unit to switch to hollow charge rounds for direct fire

    Stuka Incendiary Bombing Run

    Suggestions:
    Still seem weaker the incendiary barrage

    Tiger

    Suggestions:
    Change vet 1 ability with a range 60 AT skill shot.

    Tiger Ace

    Suggestions:
    Add an ability similar to artillery propaganda
    or
    completely redesign so that the unit scales, start as stug and can be refited to better vehicles until it reaches Tiger.

    Vehicle Crew Repair

    Suggestions:

  • #16
    1 month ago
    TremozlTremozl Posts: 322

    Would really like to see Assault Grenadiers get a buff.

    1) move them to 2CP
    2) move the 6-man upgrade to T2
    3) add a smoke grenade ability to them

  • #17
    1 month ago

    Don't know if is intended but stormtroopers don't have a bonus first strike after camouflage

  • #18
    1 month ago
    VipperVipper Posts: 3,747

    250/1 Halftrack

    The vehicle can be rather oppressive when in hull down

    Suggestions:
    Remove the suppression (lower fuel cost?)
    Reduce the RNG of passenger casualties on destruction but add suppression.

    Air Dropped Medical Supplies

    Suggestions:
    Move to Luft officer replacing reckon sweep(?)
    Allow medical kit to loaded to transport
    Picking up medical kit with pioneer/grenadier "load" them to vet 1 ability instead of activating them.

    Air Resupply Drop

    Ability is too expensive

    Suggestions:
    Replace HMG with mortar (pak with RW?) lower cost/cp adjust mu/fuel

    Ambush Camouflage

    Suggestions:
    add received accuracy modifiers,
    allow for pioneer?
    Remove sprint from the ability

    Assault Grenadiers

    Suggestions:
    Replace extra entity with MP44 upgrade

    Break Supply Line

    Suggestions:

    Breakthrough Equipment

    Suggestions:
    Remove destroy cover or add mu cost/CD make the ability free or reduce cost of upgrade

    Cargo Truck - Opel Blitz

    Suggestions:
    Allow the unit to gain vet depending on how much resources it has gathered

    Close The Pocket

    Suggestions:
    Make easier to set but lower power
    Tone down damage lower CP/Cost ability, add bonus vs unit in enemy sectors, ability does not stops one connected.

    Defensive Fortifications

    Suggestions:

    Elefant

    Suggestions:

    Entrenching Tools

    Suggestions:
    possibly add 10% construction bonus for Pioneers?

    Fragmentation Run

    Suggestions:
    Lower damage to vehicles, reduce price remove from commander with Super heavies.

    JU-87 Anti-Infantry pass

    Suggestions:

    LeFH 18

    Suggestions:

    Light Artillery Barrage

    Suggestions:

    Mechanized Assault Group

    Suggestions:

    Model 24 stun nade

    Suggestions:
    Rename "offensive" or "concussion" grenade and redesign to excel vs unit in cover/garrison

    Panzer IV Ausf. J

    The ability is almost buying a vetted PzIV redesign to bring more to the table

    Suggestions:
    Increase rear to at least PzIV vet 2 level
    Increase XP value
    offer superior penetration either reducing AI or with switchable round similar to 76mm Sherman

    Railway Artillery

    Suggestions:
    Reduce cost 180 CP to 10

    Recon Overflight

    Suggestions:

    Riegel Mine

    Suggestions:
    Rename to "anti tank training"
    PGs now can plant riegel or Tellar
    Paks now can camo when stationary with no first strike bonus

    Spotting Scope

    Suggestions:
    ability redesigned.
    add +5-10 sight
    allow the unit to use focus sight (lower range) as timed ability

    Stormtroopers

    Suggestions:
    Increased to 5 entities
    DPS of MP-40 reduced to be lower than 4 MP-40 currently available
    Tactical movement replaced by "diversion"

    Stuka Anti-Tank strafe

    Suggestions:

    Stuka CAS

    Suggestions:

    Stuka Dive Bomb

    Suggestions:
    Reduce cost to 180

    Stuka Smoke Bombs

    Suggestions:

    Supply Drop

    Suggestions:

    Tactical Movement

    Suggestions:
    add a small received accuracy modifier
    add a pack unpack bonus for HMG (?)

    Veteran Squad Leaders

    Suggestions:

  • #19
    1 month ago
    YappirYappir Posts: 87
    edited April 7

    I just took Festung support doctrine for a spin. Here are my comments.

    Lets start with Forward supply station. First of all it comes super late and costs 45 fuel.
    So I probably played x2 mortar trucks and now I am rushing a stug 3 and panzer 4 command tank. I will not have 45 fuel to spare for this. Repair bunker does not cost fuel so why would I buy this station? It seems like a huge waste of fuel and that doctrine kinda wants me to put it somewhere else.
    Maybe it could cost ammo, same as soviet industry repair stations?
    Second of all once the station is up it is kinda dull and there is nothing there. It does not heal units or anything like that.
    How about this:
    Reduce CP requirement to 2/3
    Change cost from fuel to ammo.
    Make medics purchasable in the station.
    Allow station to buff nearby units for a price or maybe let it call in cheap arty strikes nearby.
    Allow station to be a retreat point (since devs rly want to shove it for the osteer here is an opportunity instead of this cheap ass half truck for 2CP on some docs.

    Relief infantry was always a waste, replace it with tactical movement so my infantry can do the support for the tanks.

    Sector artillery lacks offensive capabilities and it is mega situational, replace it with railway arty or maybe some kind of airstrike.

    Second thing worth mentioning is German mechanized doctrine
    It will lose lefh for some kind of repair.

    This will kill this doctrine

    How it is currently played:
    You want to do arty in 3v3s but you also want to have some tanks. So with this I can both have lefh and still help my mates with command tank or some smoke stuka. Scopes can spot targets for my arty and so on.
    By removing this lefh this doctrine is useless.
    If a player wants to go for tanks he will pick something like Fortified armor doctrine or an elephant. In the new patch German mechanized doctrine has nothing. Nobody will pick some tank repairs instead of an elephant. Doctrine ahs to be either reworked further or the changes should be canceled.

  • #20
    1 month ago

    So having tried out some of the new abilities in the commanders I can say that the proposed changes such as the new Forward supply base and some of the changes to Mechanized Doc and Festung Support are not worth the changes, since the relegate these commanders from their intended role to redundant since there are other commanders which preform those roles more effectively, Storm and Spearhead come to mind.

    Festung Argument
    The proposed changes to Festung offer no benefit or enhancement to the doctrine, since this commander operates as a German equivalent to the AEF's Infantry Company and the BEF's Royal artillery offering artillery support to a player's team in 3v3 and 4v4. The proposed changes to this would turn this commander into a middling 1v1 commander outperformed by the Spearhead doctrine in that regard and useless in 3v3 and 4v4 with storm being a more effective counter arty yet overall weaker support commander. This is important because the Allies have such an overwhelming advantage in terms of artillery, infantry and demolitions that this is one of the few commanders which allows the Germans to keep up in team games. Breaking these changes down further, the command panzer is frankly the worst tank in the German roster and doesn't sync well with how this doctrine plays which is primarily artillery support in team games of 3 and up and there are better commanders where this tank shines like Fortified Armour and Blitzkreig, where it can gel better in tank builds. Secondly, the Forward supply base is honestly redundant, since the Ostheer already organically have the Bunker which can be upgrades to a medbay and command post through munitions, which is more feasible economically since the moment that ambient building is occupied it will be leveled faster then you can say artillery, since allied players have such an advantage in that regard(Soviet Demos and 120's, BEF flares. etc). So the addition of this offers no benefit to Ostheer who already have good map control and pionner builds which already are a mainstay of their tank play, especially at its current price. Overall, leave this commander as is and if it's still viewed as too 'strong' (moot point since the allies have stronger equivalents) then reduce the sector arty to one sector or increase its cost.

    Mechanized
    Overall the changes for this one aren't as negative as the Festung, the 250 is a welcome addition since it offers more non-aircraft based recon which is an area the Germans are semi-lacking in. The loss of the howitzer isn't as bad here since it was helpful but really feels like the Hummel should have been there since this is primarily tank themed and as mentioned above the Ostheer already have a good repair system via Pio tank builds, so the crew repair feels redundant. Overall, this commander feels like it comes up wanting when compared to Blitzkrieg and Mobile Defence since they all compete in the same niche. My only recommendation here would be leave the howitzer or wishlisting export the COH1 assets for the Hummel to COH2 (easier said than done) to gel better with its theme and give the Germans a welcomed mobile howitzer.

    food for thought
    Germans could use demos or satchels on some of their engineer units, since there's a problem with allied synergies like urban warfare and tanks traps which turn team games of 3 and up into a massive attrition fests which are dull or impossible to play because it's impossible to clear these paths or shift players out of these positions until you get heavy artillery or waste a ton of munitions on command abilities, at which point the Germans have already lost because they couldn't gain map control to contest the late game, maybe add in a decap similar to coh1?

  • #21
    1 month ago
    hieudo989hieudo989 Posts: 3
    edited April 9

    Nice to see improvement on pak 43, been tried it a couple of times and downright useless due to vulnerability.
    The only viable way to use it is paired along with pz4 command tank to provide defense bonus against explosion(fenstung armor), but again it is niche doctrine choice and require alot of coordination from team mate.

    Without command tank buff, 1 shot by katchiusa, calliope all the time, veterancy didn't matter.

    Compared to British counterpart, it does not have any upside when having more vulnerabilities, and they even required doctrine choice(which should always be better or at least equal to standard counterpart).

  • #22
    1 month ago
    hieudo989hieudo989 Posts: 3
    edited April 9

    Command tank : nice skill change but still only good in team game
    The core problem this tank is a deadweight in 1 v 1 . It does not excel in anything
    sight : mediorce
    aura : mediorce
    health : Mediorce
    threat to infantry : mediorce , lose to AT infantry with cover.
    cannot suppress infantry
    . lose to all opposing tank.
    aura range is useless in 1 v 1 , where you have to scatter things around the map. constant infantry retreat back and forth.

    I'd rather trade its mediorce attack capability to enhanced aura : some acc bonus, sight range
    OR 222 command tank. cheaper same aura with anti air , good sight range capability...
    OR an option to choose a more capable tank in 1 v 1 and existing tank in team game.

  • #23
    1 month ago
    hieudo989hieudo989 Posts: 3
    edited April 9

    "Hulldown" : should increase turret rotation of all tank under effect a little bit.
    "JU-87 Suppression Loiter" : noice , but could reduce a little bit further like 120 or reduce arrival time 1 or 2 second or speed of aircraft or disable/reduce accuracy of anti tank team completely(since it cannot be suppressed, and this ability deals almost no damage).
    "Vehicle Crew Repair" : ok ,but just boring.Playing as Ostheer you always need pioneer anyway... rather have upgrade package to pioneer to further speed up repair speed. OR "critical engine repair" OR even "temporay engine repair " for 10s to get out of sticky situation

    "Forward Resupply Station" : seem nice on surface, but ally have alot of burning, arty , air destruction... and once the buildings go down, this become useless anyway.

  • #24
    1 month ago
    StrategosStrategos Posts: 6

    I think it's important that it is the public what kind of player you are, i.e. team games or 1v1, whether you play a lot or not. Otherwise one would not recognize the writer's motives. To me, I haven't actively played 1v1 for a good 1 year. But follow the tournaments and often watch 1v1 games in spectator mode, I know the current metas. In my day I was top 100 with all factions. I still play team games with friends from time to time (4v4) so ​​we're around the top 50. In addition, one should express my thanks to the people from the community who update, patch and balance the game. Since they are not paid for it and they sacrifice free time for it, one should not forget that. Hope my English is not too bad:)

    Festung Armor
    The change is good, the doctrine supports a strong P4 game which is currently being played anyway. It can still be discussed whether the East P4 is better than the Okw P4 and whether you need the overhaul, but on the whole the doc is safe to play.

    Festung Support
    The change is quite good since the dok is now pretty much the same as the Soviet counterpart (city defense tactics)

    German Mechanized
    Good doctrine also supports a T3 play with P4.

    Joint Operations
    Yeah its ok.

    Luftwaffe Supply Doctrine
    That there's a new officer is cool. The drop of Pak and Mg allows the doctrine to be flexible. An offmap ability is always good.

    Mobile Defense Doctrine
    Yeah its ok.

    Storm Doctrine
    That fits very good.

    251 Mobile Observation Post
    The changes are ok but the ability is still quite weak. You should increase the range so that you can safely set the flares (+5).

    Assault and Hold
    Compared to the other ability (Radio Silence, Valiant Assault, For the Motherland), the buffs are good and the ability is not too expensive.

    Artillery officer
    Reducing the cost of reinforcement is good. However, the officer does not play because he does not fit into any build order. Since you either build 1mg 3-4Grens and then 1 PzGren or only Pios with Mgs and then Panzergren or just team weapons. The officers are a closerange support unit. However, the PzGrens fulfill this role better, so hardly anyone plays the officers. So that the officers can really be played, you have to integrate them into the various build orders. The best way to do this is to change the model back to grenadiers, remove the active combat ability (diversion) and set the stats so that the officers are a slightly better grenadier quad with 5 man. In addition, he gets all support skills and the view is reduced to normal again. This enables the player to integrate the officers perfectly into the build order.

    Breakthrough
    For the cost of abilty a good change for sure. Reduce costs to 40?

    Command Panzer IV
    The smoke grenade change is really nice so you can use the command P4 as a support unit. The two abilitys are both good too. If you want to use the P4 more as a support unit, you would use Mark Vehicle. However, if he is a bit more offensive, Light Artillery Barrage would be more appropriate. Let's see what's coming.

    Concrete Bunker
    Seems nice.

    Counter Attack Tactics
    Good changes, now a usefull ability.

    Forward Resupply Station
    The building is ok but it should be buildable and not only used in occupied houses.

    Grenadier Jeager Light Infantry Package
    This means that the G43 Grens can be used even more offensively. This enables a different style of play, so you can see more variety. They are not too weak but not too strong either.

    Hulldown
    Nice to see that ability can now be used.

    JU-87 Suppression Loiter
    Yeah its ok.

    Luftwaffe Field Officer
    Same problem as the other officer. Ability goes well with the Air Force officer, and so do the parachute models. Simply put the paratrooper k98 in your hand and adjust the stats to the grens. Then it fits perfectly into every build order.

    Mortar Halftrack Incendiary
    Bring in Line with other Mortar Halftracks

    Osttruppen
    Looks good.

    Panzer Grenadier Support Package
    Yeah its ok.

    Panzer Tactician
    Change is good, but don't forget the AEC or the M20.

    Puma
    So that this doc is played you should leave the build time at 40s but reduce the Cp to 4. So that he doesn't come too late.

    Relief Infantry
    Ability is so ok you swap ammunition for manpower.

    Sector Artillery
    Nice to see.

    Stormtroopers
    Why not.

    Strategic Bombing Run
    Should there be no incendiary bombs, only HE but over a slightly larger radius.

    StuG E
    Nice to see.

    Stuka Incendiary Bombing Run
    Makes sense.

    Tiger
    Bring in Lines with the other heavy tanks.

    Tiger Ace
    Bring in Lines with the other heavy tanks

    Vehicle Crew Repair
    Looks good.

  • #25
    1 month ago
    VipperVipper Posts: 3,747

    Tiger commanders

    Overall well designed commander but one that imo should lose the "Fragmentation Run" which is one of the best off map available to Ostheer.
    Panzer officer will better fit the theme, similar to luftwaffe officer with the ability to supervise repairs on vehicles, body guards using tank crew's skins

    Assault Support Doctrine

    Artillery officer--->Replace by Panzer Officer
    Cargo Truck - Opel Blitz
    JU-87 Anti-infantry strafe
    Fragmentation Run--->Breakthrough or Forward Resupply Station or supply drop or counter attack tactics
    Tiger

    Removing Stuka CAS for similar reasons.

    Lighting War Doctrine

    Jaeger Light Infantry
    Tactical Movement
    Relief infantry
    Stuka CAS--->Smoke bombs or Incidiary bombing
    Tiger

    Since PG are available from HQ the passenger of the Mechanized Assault Group could be more unique

    Mechanized Assault Doctrine

    Assault Grenadiers
    Mechanized Assault Group--->250 now a CP 1 comes with engineer from the campaign 5 men with lower DPS
    Stug III Ausf. E
    Light Artillery Barrage
    Tiger

    Removing Fragmentation run for the same reason.

    Spearhead Doctrine

    Mortar HT
    Panzer Tactician
    Recon Overflight
    Fragmentation Run--->Stuka AT strafe or Stuka AI strafe
    Tiger

  • #26
    1 month ago
    DST85DST85 Posts: 2
    1. Medic Stadtion and Command Post Upgrade for Bunkers could be merged into one.

    2. An Ability to decrew AT Guns and Howitzers would be nice, like in Sudden Strike.

    3. Forward Resupply Station should come earlier, be heavy fortified and also function as an Field Hospital, instead of a Repair Stadtion.

  • #27
    1 month ago
    YappirYappir Posts: 87
    edited April 11

    Lets take a look on Festung support and Festung armor.

    First: These doctrines do not bring on their own much. Festung Support without Festung falls flat.
    Second: Can these doctrines compete with other alternatives? Combo of fortified armor **and **spearhead simply outclasses these two in their own game.

    As I understand Festung armor has to make a solid wall of panzer 4s and support player has to provide mobile mortar fire, command tank and repairs. Consider that these two players need a spot on cooperation between their units what already makes it a bad idea.

    Split these up. Make both doctrines independent of each other. Otherwise, they will never be valid choices in competitive play. Lets make Festung doctrine focused on making a lot of medium tanks.

    2 CP Smoke
    3 CP Opel truck
    5 CP hull-down (THIS ABILITY SHOULD MAKE PANTHER OUTRANGE SU-85 RANGE)
    0 CP Comand Tank
    0 CP Panzer 4 J

    We scrap pak 43 as it is a joke. Buff panzer 4 a little and rework the command tank so it can provide some call ins and buffs.
    I am yet again reminding that veterancy bonuses for command tank improve its combat performance and not command bonuses.
    more about command tank here

    Festung game plan:
    - I make mg 42 and 2-3 grens
    - I drop 2 fuel catches hoping my team mate can carry me with more robust early, later on I can add an opel truck to even further increase my fuel gains
    - Once I get to T3 I start dropping as many medium tanks as I can.
    - In the late game I hope my hull down panther can outrange long-range tank destroyer of the allies (su-85, Jackson, Firefly)

    There is now a reason not to pick elephant doc (opel truck)

    Festung support

    Lets change this doctrine to be focused on both arty and infantry support

    2 CP mortar truck
    2 CP veteran infantry (from inf doc)
    2 CP Stuka smoke drop
    3 CP repair stations
    12 CP Railway cannon

    We replace sector arty to get some more offensive capabilities, veteran infantry and mortar halftrucks make this doctrine valid in the earliest stages of the game, covering the weakness of my teammate.

    Support game plan
    - I make beefy early game, I am not in rush to go T2
    - when I get 2 CP I drop myself 2 mortar half trucks to provide early artillery advantage
    - When the time comes I make pak 40 and 222
    - Stuka smoke drops spot targets and smokes for my infantry pushes
    - I slowly transition into late game

    There is now a reason not to go for the spearhead (superior infantry)

  • #28
    1 month ago
    YappirYappir Posts: 87
    edited April 14

    I just noted that panzer jager doctrine gets a mobile observation post
    WHAT?! XD
    how much vision do you think this doctrine needs?!
    It has scout plane has sporting scope now it gets this.
    waste of a commander slot 0/10 would not recommend

    If you really want this thing to be used by osteer players so badly just add it as the default function of 251 truck and do not just make good doctrines bad.

    PS
    Do not remove the regiel mine as it has synergy with stuka airstrike.
    If you REALLY want to add a mobile observation post replace recon flight with it. This will even more encourage players to make 251 trucks as it will be having 2 doctrine abilities not 1.

  • #29
    1 month ago
    YappirYappir Posts: 87

    If the player actives "spearhead" ability on the tiger ace while the tank turret is facing backward, the turret will be instantly teleported to the maximum range of the angle (45 degrees left or right).
    This could be exploited to instantly traverse the turret.

  • #30
    1 month ago
    Arcturus64Arcturus64 Posts: 10

    The tooltip for the Mobile observation post should mention that it also includes the Riegel 43 mines as it looks and sounds confusing (See example above of Yappir who thought the mine was removed while it was in fact merged WITH the Mobile observation post).
    In my screenshot, you can see I'm using the Mobile Defense CO who has the mobile observation post, yet my HT can use the Riegel 43 Mine.

  • #31
    1 month ago
    Arcturus64Arcturus64 Posts: 10

    Not sure if this should be put in the Beta or not since I didn't try in the live version,
    but the Puma's "Aimed shot" (Ostheer and OKW) doesn't inflict any status effect on the ISU-152 even when hitting the rear armor.

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