I agree that the Allies feel way stronger than the Axis.

But I think this can't be solved with readjustments of some numbers.

Sure one or the other things have to be adjusted, like they do in every patch when the meta changes to drastically.

But general speaking about your point, that Allies always feel more powerful. I think it is more related to the very beginner friendly game characteristics of the Allies factions.
Allies have way more options in terms of units & upgrades. Their techtree AND doctrines are way more versatile...

Right from the start.. the dingo & 4x4 jeep start has been a major difficulty for the axis since ever
The non doctrinal Bishop... (imagine having a non doctrinal Wespe ??)
The absurdly overwhelming easy to play usf Airborne, which can spam abilities & drop powerful units all the time, doesn't require much skill at all

Or the way to tanky Brit tanks.. /lack in dmg Axis tanks

The skill gap between the factions is just very obvious.

I made a post about that already, asking for a Wher rework/redesign for the exact same reason..
Where I ran down a lot of examples why I think it is like that

https://community.companyofheroes.com/coh-franchise-home/company-of-heroes-3/forums/8-coh3-multiplayer/threads/12389-wehr-needs-a-redesign-rework-badly?page=1

Check it out to see a detailed summary of the problem from my point of view :)

Friya_ wrote:

I have been playing the Allied side since Series 1.

Currently, the Allied forces are so powerful that it's almost unreasonable.

U.S. Improvement Requests

The range and damage of the Bazooka should be reduced.

The cost of the Bazooka Squad's white phosphorus shell should be increased.

The HP of the Sherman and Hellcat should be reduced.

The United States' anti-tank capabilities should be nerfed.

Can't speak to the UK so only for USF here -

The US base bazooka is TRASH compared to pshrek or pfasut... bazooka does NO damage and theres 2 per squad... even when upgraded they're not great in comparison
WP shell on the zook squad is also useless, barely helps because they have no HP to survive any battle
Shermans and Hellcats are already PAPER... they die SO FAST
US AT is NOTHING compared to German AT... the german PAK range is so fucked it's insane.

at this point im convinced you're lying about being an allies player LOL holy moly go play axis if you're just gonna bitch

But general speaking about your point, that Allies always feel more powerful. I think it is more related to the very beginner friendly game characteristics of the Allies factions.
Allies have way more options in terms of units & upgrades. Their techtree AND doctrines are way more versatile...

Right from the start.. the dingo & 4x4 jeep start has been a major difficulty for the axis since ever
The non doctrinal Bishop... (imagine having a non doctrinal Wespe ??)
The absurdly overwhelming easy to play usf Airborne, which can spam abilities & drop powerful units all the time, doesn't require much skill at all

Or the way to tanky Brit tanks.. /lack in dmg Axis tanks

The skill gap between the factions is just very obvious.

I made a post about that already, asking for a Wher rework/redesign for the exact same reason..
Where I ran down a lot of examples why I think it is like that

https://community.companyofheroes.com/coh-franchise-home/company-of-heroes-3/forums/8-coh3-multiplayer/threads/12389-wehr-needs-a-redesign-rework-badly?page=1

Check it out to see a detailed summary of the problem from my point of view :)

This is ALSO a complete JOKE LOL
The germans have SO MUCH MORE UNITS AND UPGRADES that it's not even CLOSE

Germans can spam 250 WITH TROOPS INSIDE able to shoot out of it from the git go... that absolutely wrecks ANY 4x4 jeep.
GERMANS ALSO HAVE AN AIRBORE TO DROP POWERFUL TROOPS ALL THE TIME??? what the heck even is your comment??

can't speak for brits on this behalf

ThiccBunn wrote:

Friya_ wrote:

I have been playing the Allied side since Series 1.

Currently, the Allied forces are so powerful that it's almost unreasonable.

U.S. Improvement Requests

The range and damage of the Bazooka should be reduced.

The cost of the Bazooka Squad's white phosphorus shell should be increased.

The HP of the Sherman and Hellcat should be reduced.

The United States' anti-tank capabilities should be nerfed.

Can't speak to the UK so only for USF here -

The US base bazooka is TRASH compared to pshrek or pfasut... bazooka does NO damage and theres 2 per squad... even when upgraded they're not great in comparison
WP shell on the zook squad is also useless, barely helps because they have no HP to survive any battle
Shermans and Hellcats are already PAPER... they die SO FAST
US AT is NOTHING compared to German AT... the german PAK range is so fucked it's insane.

at this point im convinced you're lying about being an allies player LOL holy moly go play axis if you're just gonna bitch

If you write your opinion well but end it with a word like "bitch," it loses its persuasiveness.

Friya_ wrote:

ThiccBunn wrote:

Friya_ wrote:

I have been playing the Allied side since Series 1.

Currently, the Allied forces are so powerful that it's almost unreasonable.

U.S. Improvement Requests

The range and damage of the Bazooka should be reduced.

The cost of the Bazooka Squad's white phosphorus shell should be increased.

The HP of the Sherman and Hellcat should be reduced.

The United States' anti-tank capabilities should be nerfed.

Can't speak to the UK so only for USF here -

The US base bazooka is TRASH compared to pshrek or pfasut... bazooka does NO damage and theres 2 per squad... even when upgraded they're not great in comparison
WP shell on the zook squad is also useless, barely helps because they have no HP to survive any battle
Shermans and Hellcats are already PAPER... they die SO FAST
US AT is NOTHING compared to German AT... the german PAK range is so fucked it's insane.

at this point im convinced you're lying about being an allies player LOL holy moly go play axis if you're just gonna bitch

If you write your opinion well but end it with a word like "bitch," it loses its persuasiveness.

gotta keep it real for the homies. you're basically complaining about winning but doing it wrong?
This entire forum is the germans bitching about how OP americans are... meanwhile germans have the most OP shit in the game

Crowhind wrote:

ThiccBunnwrote:

Germans can spam 250 WITH TROOPS INSIDE able to shoot out of it from the git go... that absolutely wrecks ANY 4x4 jeep.

This is DAK only my friend.. Wher has nothing against early vehicle aggression. It is especially (not)funny when in a 4vs4 facing premates, which focus one Wehr player down like that with multiple Dingos & 4x4s...

The only thing Wehr could do, is the vet upgrade to potentially faust them. Which costs fuel and throws back your tech... Also, they just Kite your Grens if they're not fully stupid.
Nowdays I often see MG + Dingo/4x4 start for exact that reason. Kite into MG...

ThiccBunnwrote:

GERMANS ALSO HAVE AN AIRBORE TO DROP POWERFUL TROOPS ALL THE TIME??? what the heck even is your comment??

They have FallschirmPIOs ... you get it, right? They're PIONIEERS..

Sure they're fun. And they're actually not bad in the beginning. They offer some tactics. But dropping them in the Lategame? Nobody would do that.

And the Falschirmjäger? Even tho they got buffed recently, so they are actually able to deal some demage now. BUT they're still super squishy. So you would never drop them behind enemy lines, like Paratroopers from the USF-Airborne. Coz you risk losing them right away.

Falschirmjäger 4 Models 460 HP
Paratroopers 6 Models 660 HP

Uh, and guess what?? They also got ZERO UPGRADES!!! unlike Paratroopers which can have either TWO M9 Bazooka or TWO M1919A6 Light Machine Guns!!

You see, just another example how unfair this game is designed. Always in favor for the Allies.

Those grenade launchers when blobbed (Which happens every time) can take out early light stuff like AA halftrack because USF can't suppress troops.
I cant even get an MG in place and firing before its decimated by GL blobs
Wehr might not have super early, but they can toss out that pretty early flakverling which has little to no opposition early. especially when infantry squads all have panzerfaust to counter greyhound or chaffee.
I could toss out a bazooka squad but they are PAPER and get suppressed before I can get close.
AT gun does nothing unless PERFECTLY placed, the flak just goes around after tanking the first hit and there goes the gun.

USF Paratroops are strong yeah but they're not insanely OP or anything.
but you can't have that comment about dropping troops when germans can do it too. 

LP_SCORP10N wrote:

In my opinion the coh series have always had a system in which the allies are weaker than the axis and to win they need to create huge numbers of their units. This being said coh3 follows the same path but the allies arent weak anymore.

I don't like this design I think its horrible for any faction, every faction unit in this game should be strong and not resume itselft to spam. Come on american troops were hard fighting man, they shouldnt be represent as blob fest, its just desrespectfull

Same applies to the brits, same aplies to the axis and especially to the italians that didnt had major resources but showed a lot of courage in the war.

The popcost of units is completely wrong, units should be 4 man at least. Special units should be 6 man at least, this is for all factions. The fact that a 4 man squad faces a 6 man squad, will resolve in a defeat since the dps drops a lot after the first man dies.

Since there are not realism/history to be respected, axis should have a light vehicle/tank that can face greyhound/chaffee and stuart. It doesnt make any sense that the faction that had the biggest diversity in war vehicles/tanks doesnt have anything with a cannon to face them.

Overall all the factions should be hard reseted and changed once and for all, so this game stops being a tower defence for the axis and compstomp for the allies. Also the battlegroups really need a rework too because there are too many powercreeps around them.

This is what the multiplayer needs

The singleplayer/coop needs those coop missions from coh1 and more missions for campaign with secret achievements.

Damm me but I love the series COH and COH3 is becoming a either it survives or is no more. So we need to put our bias to the side and start pushing the overall ideas so this game turns around and gets more people in playing it.

Anyways these are my 2 cents, ty for the patience for reading them :)

I highly respect your opinion and believe it is a valid one.

ThiccBunn wrote:

Crowhind wrote:

ThiccBunnwrote:

Germans can spam 250 WITH TROOPS INSIDE able to shoot out of it from the git go... that absolutely wrecks ANY 4x4 jeep.

This is DAK only my friend.. Wher has nothing against early vehicle aggression. It is especially (not)funny when in a 4vs4 facing premates, which focus one Wehr player down like that with multiple Dingos & 4x4s...

The only thing Wehr could do, is the vet upgrade to potentially faust them. Which costs fuel and throws back your tech... Also, they just Kite your Grens if they're not fully stupid.
Nowdays I often see MG + Dingo/4x4 start for exact that reason. Kite into MG...

ThiccBunnwrote:

GERMANS ALSO HAVE AN AIRBORE TO DROP POWERFUL TROOPS ALL THE TIME??? what the heck even is your comment??

They have FallschirmPIOs ... you get it, right? They're PIONIEERS..

Sure they're fun. And they're actually not bad in the beginning. They offer some tactics. But dropping them in the Lategame? Nobody would do that.

And the Falschirmjäger? Even tho they got buffed recently, so they are actually able to deal some demage now. BUT they're still super squishy. So you would never drop them behind enemy lines, like Paratroopers from the USF-Airborne. Coz you risk losing them right away.

Falschirmjäger 4 Models 460 HP
Paratroopers 6 Models 660 HP

Uh, and guess what?? They also got ZERO UPGRADES!!! unlike Paratroopers which can have either TWO M9 Bazooka or TWO M1919A6 Light Machine Guns!!

You see, just another example how unfair this game is designed. Always in favor for the Allies.

Those grenade launchers when blobbed (Which happens every time) can take out early light stuff like AA halftrack because USF can't suppress troops.
I cant even get an MG in place and firing before its decimated by GL blobs
Wehr might not have super early, but they can toss out that pretty early flakverling which has little to no opposition early. especially when infantry squads all have panzerfaust to counter greyhound or chaffee.
I could toss out a bazooka squad but they are PAPER and get suppressed before I can get close.
AT gun does nothing unless PERFECTLY placed, the flak just goes around after tanking the first hit and there goes the gun.

USF Paratroops are strong yeah but they're not insanely OP or anything.
but you can't have that comment about dropping troops when germans can do it too. 

You make a valid point. I don't think what you're saying is wrong.
However, your behavior is still inappropriate.
This is not an anonymous community site; it's a place to discuss balance.
Please refrain from posting derogatory comments about others and don't tarnish your own character.

shut the fuk up, friya, wtf you talking about?

Yeah... I really don't know how someone can claim that Axis is OP in any regard. The Allied fanboys constantly bring up one single thing and that is the stuka loiter, which at this point drops from the sky after one strafe, so I really don't know how it is so game winning... But logic won't ever work with ppl who immediately call others "bitch" or "fuck you" just because you dare mention their favorite faction may be imbalanced. Most patches at the higher elo ranges Allies have much higher win rates than axis and someone will say, why bring up the higher elo brackets? Simply because they are the only ones that show the state of the game. In lower brackets people constantly match against players who are much better than them and therefore the matchmaker equals out the win rate. At higher elo ranges there aren't any massively better players to match against, so the strengths and weaknesses of the factions are actually shown.

At this time USF is batshit insane and has so many inexplicable advantages that it is extremely difficult to beat someone on your level. Almost every unit is able to deal in some regard with any unit type. Winning engagements requires almost no setup and literally all you need to do is walk your blob up to the enemy and win. This dynamic changes when tanks start showing up, but axis is usually bled of manpower and map control so bad at that point that it doesn't matter and USF don't even need to build dedicated AT cause all they need to do is click the magical sprint button and spam a tank with AT nades and almost everything will die to this except the late game heavy armor. And I hear it, you can reverse away from sprint bla bla bla. BS, if it was so easy to dodge it wouldn't be spammed on every rifle squad every game. Sure, If all the stars align, you can reverse away, but the pathing in this game is such cancer that it is guaranteed any reverse maneuver in anything but an open field will result in the vehicle spinning right round baby right round. This is exacerbated for axis vics as they tend to have a much lower acceleration god only knows why.

All this creates a situation, where Axis aren't able to keep up with allied inf in any realistic way so they need to invest fully into anti inf units but once they do all USF needs to do is build a greyhound or smthing and axis have no answer to this except dedicated AT units because their mainline inf doesnt get a magical sprint to win button.

There is a lot more of this stupidity with USF, like why does the USF mortar get laser beam accuracy while no one else does?

Why does the bazooka team, a dedicated AT unit get a skill that instantly removes team weapons from combat?

Why does the 4x4 get beyond retarded on the move repair?

Why do allied players complain about having to side tech when both their T1 and T2 buildings are cheaper than T1 alone for DAK and thats not mentioning the upgrade.

Why does the allied halftrack get a very strong anti inf barrage when it is an AT unit and why does it have formula 1 mobility.

Why does the much cheaper and available earlier chaffee win with PIIIs half the time.

There is much more but I'll end the spam here.

Axis has nothing even close to these. The only unit that is actually good on the axis side taking into account the cost and timing is the AA halftrack and even that is super easy to kill so it requires a lot of care and micro. 

SEPH_27 wrote:

Yeah... I really don't know how someone can claim that Axis is OP in any regard. The Allied fanboys constantly bring up one single thing and that is the stuka loiter, which at this point drops from the sky after one strafe, so I really don't know how it is so game winning... But logic won't ever work with ppl who immediately call others "bitch" or "fuck you" just because you dare mention their favorite faction may be imbalanced. Most patches at the higher elo ranges Allies have much higher win rates than axis and someone will say, why bring up the higher elo brackets? Simply because they are the only ones that show the state of the game. In lower brackets people constantly match against players who are much better than them and therefore the matchmaker equals out the win rate. At higher elo ranges there aren't any massively better players to match against, so the strengths and weaknesses of the factions are actually shown.

At this time USF is batshit insane and has so many inexplicable advantages that it is extremely difficult to beat someone on your level. Almost every unit is able to deal in some regard with any unit type. Winning engagements requires almost no setup and literally all you need to do is walk your blob up to the enemy and win. This dynamic changes when tanks start showing up, but axis is usually bled of manpower and map control so bad at that point that it doesn't matter and USF don't even need to build dedicated AT cause all they need to do is click the magical sprint button and spam a tank with AT nades and almost everything will die to this except the late game heavy armor. And I hear it, you can reverse away from sprint bla bla bla. BS, if it was so easy to dodge it wouldn't be spammed on every rifle squad every game. Sure, If all the stars align, you can reverse away, but the pathing in this game is such cancer that it is guaranteed any reverse maneuver in anything but an open field will result in the vehicle spinning right round baby right round. This is exacerbated for axis vics as they tend to have a much lower acceleration god only knows why.

All this creates a situation, where Axis aren't able to keep up with allied inf in any realistic way so they need to invest fully into anti inf units but once they do all USF needs to do is build a greyhound or smthing and axis have no answer to this except dedicated AT units because their mainline inf doesnt get a magical sprint to win button.

There is a lot more of this stupidity with USF, like why does the USF mortar get laser beam accuracy while no one else does?

Why does the bazooka team, a dedicated AT unit get a skill that instantly removes team weapons from combat?

Why does the 4x4 get beyond retarded on the move repair?

Why do allied players complain about having to side tech when both their T1 and T2 buildings are cheaper than T1 alone for DAK and thats not mentioning the upgrade.

Why does the allied halftrack get a very strong anti inf barrage when it is an AT unit and why does it have formula 1 mobility.

Why does the much cheaper and available earlier chaffee win with PIIIs half the time.

There is much more but I'll end the spam here.

Axis has nothing even close to these. The only unit that is actually good on the axis side taking into account the cost and timing is the AA halftrack and even that is super easy to kill so it requires a lot of care and micro. 

Nobody said "fuck you" lol

Also nobody is talking about ELO here either? The game is incredibly unbalanced with matchmaking, though.

Never said anything about the stuka loiter here, but it is insanely broken. It can take out tanks with a strafing run but allied P-47 bombing run can't take out a MG squad? where it drops actual bombs?
USF bazookas do NOTHING to enemy armor and are even worse against any infantry squads they run into along the way... which is a lot considering all germans do is blob.

USF Bazooka squads do not have a magical sprint button... you might be talking about rangers which we aren't talking about here...

Also nobody even said anything about rifle squads either so not sure where you get that from...

Pathing is absolutely garbage we can agree on that.

USF has ONE regular ass mortar that is no laser beam... meanwhile germans have a regular mortar with more range, the walking stuka, nebelwerfers, those other long range mortar, that tank hunter that also turns into artillery, and probably others i'm missing...

Allied halftrrack with the AT gun is basically paper, it has the durabilty of a 250 but we can't put any troops in it to run around in... two AT bombs or two panzerfaust (Which is very similar to the rifle squads you were talking about...) can take it out before it can move.

P3 can beat a sherman, chaffees are also made of paper, but they are fast because they're lightweight.

Your reply was an absolute joke lol the axis have SO many more things at their disposal whether it's DAK or Wehr. It's not even close. you can look at it in the loadout menu lol

SEPH_27 wrote:

Yeah... I really don't know how someone can claim that Axis is OP in any regard. The Allied fanboys constantly bring up one single thing and that is the stuka loiter, which at this point drops from the sky after one strafe, so I really don't know how it is so game winning... But logic won't ever work with ppl who immediately call others "bitch" or "fuck you" just because you dare mention their favorite faction may be imbalanced. Most patches at the higher elo ranges Allies have much higher win rates than axis and someone will say, why bring up the higher elo brackets? Simply because they are the only ones that show the state of the game. In lower brackets people constantly match against players who are much better than them and therefore the matchmaker equals out the win rate. At higher elo ranges there aren't any massively better players to match against, so the strengths and weaknesses of the factions are actually shown.

At this time USF is batshit insane and has so many inexplicable advantages that it is extremely difficult to beat someone on your level. Almost every unit is able to deal in some regard with any unit type. Winning engagements requires almost no setup and literally all you need to do is walk your blob up to the enemy and win. This dynamic changes when tanks start showing up, but axis is usually bled of manpower and map control so bad at that point that it doesn't matter and USF don't even need to build dedicated AT cause all they need to do is click the magical sprint button and spam a tank with AT nades and almost everything will die to this except the late game heavy armor. And I hear it, you can reverse away from sprint bla bla bla. BS, if it was so easy to dodge it wouldn't be spammed on every rifle squad every game. Sure, If all the stars align, you can reverse away, but the pathing in this game is such cancer that it is guaranteed any reverse maneuver in anything but an open field will result in the vehicle spinning right round baby right round. This is exacerbated for axis vics as they tend to have a much lower acceleration god only knows why.

All this creates a situation, where Axis aren't able to keep up with allied inf in any realistic way so they need to invest fully into anti inf units but once they do all USF needs to do is build a greyhound or smthing and axis have no answer to this except dedicated AT units because their mainline inf doesnt get a magical sprint to win button.

There is a lot more of this stupidity with USF, like why does the USF mortar get laser beam accuracy while no one else does?

Why does the bazooka team, a dedicated AT unit get a skill that instantly removes team weapons from combat?

Why does the 4x4 get beyond retarded on the move repair?

Why do allied players complain about having to side tech when both their T1 and T2 buildings are cheaper than T1 alone for DAK and thats not mentioning the upgrade.

Why does the allied halftrack get a very strong anti inf barrage when it is an AT unit and why does it have formula 1 mobility.

Why does the much cheaper and available earlier chaffee win with PIIIs half the time.

There is much more but I'll end the spam here.

Axis has nothing even close to these. The only unit that is actually good on the axis side taking into account the cost and timing is the AA halftrack and even that is super easy to kill so it requires a lot of care and micro. 

There is a lot wrong with this post. The loiter doesn't drop from the sky after one strafe. Which btw, is guaranteed to hit, unlike the british rockets at strafe. And it will also instantly pin infantry units.

I've seen plenty of axis blob pull insane stuff. In fact it's easier for them since allies dont get the mg42. It's the only one that's super effective at it machine gun role, with the suppression area being so big it can sometimes suppress squads it shouldnt. Like, if 2 allies squad stand on either side of a luftwaffe bunker, an Mg birst can suppress the squad that's way outside its arc of fire, even standing behind the mg. 

The stummel is very good, the flakvierling truck for dak also it, and you get the upgraded 250 armored car which can quickly get out of hand.

Horrendous pathing affects everyone.

The US mortar isn't mortar beam accurate. that's the wespe.

The zook squad doesn't instantly removed the mg from combat, it forces it to move and suffer a bit of damage. It's more expensive than a simple smoke.

The allied halfytrack ? do you even know what you're saying ? The anti tank halftrack from the USF gets a slow barrage, but no formula 1 ability. That's for the quad, at most.

Vetrancy for the anti tank halftrack is a first shot bonus or a turret blocking shot.

USF and UK need to build a building before being able to produce mainline infantry and vehicles, unlike dak. T1 gives them access to assault grens, jaegers, mg34..

Chafee doesn't win  alone half the time against pz3.

Marders are good. Bike is good. radio truck is good, ambulance is goo and gives insane bonuses at vet1. leig is good. pz3 is greaat with upgrades, and tiger is downright insane.

Hell yeah this guy gets it

We are all discussing small things, things that will continue to be discussed in the next patches because they either will be buffed or nerfed and than a new power creep will exist. This is not the way to solve the problem this game has.

As I already said popcap cost of units need to be changed, economy of factions need to be changed and also the number of units of each squad.

Tanks and vehicles need to be different, at this moment they either are very relevant or nothing at all.

Every faction has its quirks in buildings and units.

Although I like Dak it seems to me that its strangled by the historic factor, it makes sense but it doesnt work when the other factions arent limited by it. The same applies to brits, they should have africa material but then they have italian campaign material and its a mixed bubble.

Listen guys this game is full of ups and downs every time a patch is out, its not by changing only one or two units that is going to solve it. I think the community should see the main core of the problem, the basis that is instable and when a slight change is applied to a unit that basis trembles as an earthquake.

Ty for your patience for reading this long post.

ThiccBunn wrote:

SEPH_27 wrote:

Yeah... I really don't know how someone can claim that Axis is OP in any regard. The Allied fanboys constantly bring up one single thing and that is the stuka loiter, which at this point drops from the sky after one strafe, so I really don't know how it is so game winning... But logic won't ever work with ppl who immediately call others "bitch" or "fuck you" just because you dare mention their favorite faction may be imbalanced. Most patches at the higher elo ranges Allies have much higher win rates than axis and someone will say, why bring up the higher elo brackets? Simply because they are the only ones that show the state of the game. In lower brackets people constantly match against players who are much better than them and therefore the matchmaker equals out the win rate. At higher elo ranges there aren't any massively better players to match against, so the strengths and weaknesses of the factions are actually shown.

At this time USF is batshit insane and has so many inexplicable advantages that it is extremely difficult to beat someone on your level. Almost every unit is able to deal in some regard with any unit type. Winning engagements requires almost no setup and literally all you need to do is walk your blob up to the enemy and win. This dynamic changes when tanks start showing up, but axis is usually bled of manpower and map control so bad at that point that it doesn't matter and USF don't even need to build dedicated AT cause all they need to do is click the magical sprint button and spam a tank with AT nades and almost everything will die to this except the late game heavy armor. And I hear it, you can reverse away from sprint bla bla bla. BS, if it was so easy to dodge it wouldn't be spammed on every rifle squad every game. Sure, If all the stars align, you can reverse away, but the pathing in this game is such cancer that it is guaranteed any reverse maneuver in anything but an open field will result in the vehicle spinning right round baby right round. This is exacerbated for axis vics as they tend to have a much lower acceleration god only knows why.

All this creates a situation, where Axis aren't able to keep up with allied inf in any realistic way so they need to invest fully into anti inf units but once they do all USF needs to do is build a greyhound or smthing and axis have no answer to this except dedicated AT units because their mainline inf doesnt get a magical sprint to win button.

There is a lot more of this stupidity with USF, like why does the USF mortar get laser beam accuracy while no one else does?

Why does the bazooka team, a dedicated AT unit get a skill that instantly removes team weapons from combat?

Why does the 4x4 get beyond retarded on the move repair?

Why do allied players complain about having to side tech when both their T1 and T2 buildings are cheaper than T1 alone for DAK and thats not mentioning the upgrade.

Why does the allied halftrack get a very strong anti inf barrage when it is an AT unit and why does it have formula 1 mobility.

Why does the much cheaper and available earlier chaffee win with PIIIs half the time.

There is much more but I'll end the spam here.

Axis has nothing even close to these. The only unit that is actually good on the axis side taking into account the cost and timing is the AA halftrack and even that is super easy to kill so it requires a lot of care and micro. 

Nobody said "fuck you" lol

Also nobody is talking about ELO here either? The game is incredibly unbalanced with matchmaking, though.

Never said anything about the stuka loiter here, but it is insanely broken. It can take out tanks with a strafing run but allied P-47 bombing run can't take out a MG squad? where it drops actual bombs?
USF bazookas do NOTHING to enemy armor and are even worse against any infantry squads they run into along the way... which is a lot considering all germans do is blob.

USF Bazooka squads do not have a magical sprint button... you might be talking about rangers which we aren't talking about here...

Also nobody even said anything about rifle squads either so not sure where you get that from...

Pathing is absolutely garbage we can agree on that.

USF has ONE regular ass mortar that is no laser beam... meanwhile germans have a regular mortar with more range, the walking stuka, nebelwerfers, those other long range mortar, that tank hunter that also turns into artillery, and probably others i'm missing...

Allied halftrrack with the AT gun is basically paper, it has the durabilty of a 250 but we can't put any troops in it to run around in... two AT bombs or two panzerfaust (Which is very similar to the rifle squads you were talking about...) can take it out before it can move.

P3 can beat a sherman, chaffees are also made of paper, but they are fast because they're lightweight.

Your reply was an absolute joke lol the axis have SO many more things at their disposal whether it's DAK or Wehr. It's not even close. you can look at it in the loadout menu lol

Since you are taking the time to reply go ahead and try to read with comprehension as well. As for the "fuck you" part, I believe you posted that in a different thread but pinning down the exact phrase is irrelevant as "bitch" or "shut the fuck up" is just about the same level of quality conversation and shows how totally unemotional you are about these things.

The things I wrote about aren't replies to you or this thread exclusively, they are what is often brought up in the community, so I am addressing these preemptively.

You mentioned the stuka loiter in another thread but it is cried about so often it is worth addressing. YES IT IS A GOOD ABILITY. There, I said it. The allied strafe is generally worse I agree, but at the same time it can deal a lot more damage if the rockets actually hit. Sometimes this allows it to basically snipe units like the tiger if it gets cancer pathing and starts turning in place which happens fairly often.

I'm suspicious of your claim that the p47 bombing run can't take out an MG as I have seen it happen a bunch of times. If you expect it to arrive so quickly that the MG has no chance of escaping that's another thing but the trade off between strafes is that the bombs are very likely to actually wipe a unit while the gun run is more likely to hit but will never wipe a full hp unit. Also, this isn't even a point to discuss because USF has access to both the bombs and the guns while axis only has guns... You are literally complaining that USF has more tools to choose from...

Again, another point of contention that leads me to think you don't know about the unit stats and are just going off of feelings, I'm not sure what you expect from the bazooka team but they are a unit in the same class as DAK panzerjaegers so they shouldn't exactly be able to solo tigers... But just to clear things up, they are better than pjaegers in almost every regard. They have the same ROF, more damage (50 vs. 60), way more pen, they are more adaptable as they can choose between two very powerful abilities and despite all this they can be built earlier and are cheaper which is insane. The only thing pjaegers have over the bazooka teams is accuracy. An this is not even taking into account the god damn bazooka upgrade USF has so in what world are pjaegers better? These are facts mind you, not my opinion, feel free to check the game stats.

Germans blobbing... Again, in what world? Axis have more expensive infantry and don't get manpower cheats except in one doctrine while USF gets them standard and brits get them in one doctrine like wehr while DAK gets nothing, so tell me please what twisted logic did you use to arrive at this conclusion? The math just doesn't check out.

Of course bazooka squads don't have sprint, if you read what I wrote more carefully you would notice I was talking about rifleman, who definitely do have it. It is true, no one was talking about rifles, but if you are mentioning units and abilities that you feel are op on the axis side I think I have the right to mention what I feel is op or at the very least absolute cancer game design on the allied side, or am I just allowed to reply to you?

Pathing is absolute dogshit, AGREED!

USF mortar is way better than any other basic mortar, comparing it to higher end artillery is pointless unless you expect a T1 USF unit to be as powerful as T3 or T4 axis units but that is so absurd I will approach this with good will and assume that isn't the case. As for why, again all you need to do is check the game stats. It has a literally and I am not kidding over twice better scatter area than any other basic mortar. Also, germans don't just have a mortar. Both allied factions get a standard mortar while DAK doesn't get one at all. The DAK "long range mortar" as you call it comes pretty late and is much more expensive as well as much easier to counter barrage and after the nerfs it got it isn't even all that strong but the main issue is that it is pretty hard to fit in DAK builds so I don't get the complaints. Stuka and nebel are very good units, that is true, but they kind of have to be because they are compensating for a lack of call in artillery on the axis side. If they weren't then axis would have no chance in fighting late game vetted inf and it's tough even with these tools. I would be happy if they made the axis mainlines on par with the allied ones but that isn't happening so there has to be some tool to compensate and these are it.

Yes, the AT halftrack is indeed easy to kill once you catch it out of position but doing that against a good player (again, this is why elo matters) is extremely hard, because the thing is very maneuverable and good at firing on the move. In comparison the same tier unit for axis is the 221 that can't deal with inf and tanks at the same time and is even easier to kill at 240hp vs. the halftracks 320 even a higher tier unit for axis like the DAK marder is way slower, doesn't have a super strong stun ability while also having an AI barrage... Like srsly. If it wasn't for the damage diff, the halftrack would be a straight up better unit than the marder despite it being higher tier and I think that is pretty absurd. Btw, the hp on the marder is 360 so it can take literally one more bazooka shot than the halftrack, that isn't that much of a difference tbh.

Yes, P3 can beat a sherman sometimes after 1200mp in upgrades where DAK is starved for manpower like no one else. If you rush it, the first P3 can be out 15 fuel faster than a sherman. That's like half a minute so not much of a difference, definitely not enough to have a meaningful impact and without the upgrades it will almost surely loose. Also, these are same tier units with a similar cost. The chaffee comes much earlier and is much cheaper in and of itself but it being on the field effectively shuts down any plays with the P3 because if it is hit even once by an AT gun the chaffee will chase it down and kill it. This means, that a much more expensive tank from a higher tier building is exerting a similar field presence to the chaffee and that just isn't right.

My post is a joke huh? Why don't you refer me some actual game knowledge as I did to you and prove me wrong. The loadout menu is for cosmetics, so... I'm not sure what that has to do with anything but nice try.

Kamfrenchie1 wrote:

SEPH_27 wrote:

Yeah... I really don't know how someone can claim that Axis is OP in any regard. The Allied fanboys constantly bring up one single thing and that is the stuka loiter, which at this point drops from the sky after one strafe, so I really don't know how it is so game winning... But logic won't ever work with ppl who immediately call others "bitch" or "fuck you" just because you dare mention their favorite faction may be imbalanced. Most patches at the higher elo ranges Allies have much higher win rates than axis and someone will say, why bring up the higher elo brackets? Simply because they are the only ones that show the state of the game. In lower brackets people constantly match against players who are much better than them and therefore the matchmaker equals out the win rate. At higher elo ranges there aren't any massively better players to match against, so the strengths and weaknesses of the factions are actually shown.

At this time USF is batshit insane and has so many inexplicable advantages that it is extremely difficult to beat someone on your level. Almost every unit is able to deal in some regard with any unit type. Winning engagements requires almost no setup and literally all you need to do is walk your blob up to the enemy and win. This dynamic changes when tanks start showing up, but axis is usually bled of manpower and map control so bad at that point that it doesn't matter and USF don't even need to build dedicated AT cause all they need to do is click the magical sprint button and spam a tank with AT nades and almost everything will die to this except the late game heavy armor. And I hear it, you can reverse away from sprint bla bla bla. BS, if it was so easy to dodge it wouldn't be spammed on every rifle squad every game. Sure, If all the stars align, you can reverse away, but the pathing in this game is such cancer that it is guaranteed any reverse maneuver in anything but an open field will result in the vehicle spinning right round baby right round. This is exacerbated for axis vics as they tend to have a much lower acceleration god only knows why.

All this creates a situation, where Axis aren't able to keep up with allied inf in any realistic way so they need to invest fully into anti inf units but once they do all USF needs to do is build a greyhound or smthing and axis have no answer to this except dedicated AT units because their mainline inf doesnt get a magical sprint to win button.

There is a lot more of this stupidity with USF, like why does the USF mortar get laser beam accuracy while no one else does?

Why does the bazooka team, a dedicated AT unit get a skill that instantly removes team weapons from combat?

Why does the 4x4 get beyond retarded on the move repair?

Why do allied players complain about having to side tech when both their T1 and T2 buildings are cheaper than T1 alone for DAK and thats not mentioning the upgrade.

Why does the allied halftrack get a very strong anti inf barrage when it is an AT unit and why does it have formula 1 mobility.

Why does the much cheaper and available earlier chaffee win with PIIIs half the time.

There is much more but I'll end the spam here.

Axis has nothing even close to these. The only unit that is actually good on the axis side taking into account the cost and timing is the AA halftrack and even that is super easy to kill so it requires a lot of care and micro. 

There is a lot wrong with this post. The loiter doesn't drop from the sky after one strafe. Which btw, is guaranteed to hit, unlike the british rockets at strafe. And it will also instantly pin infantry units.

I've seen plenty of axis blob pull insane stuff. In fact it's easier for them since allies dont get the mg42. It's the only one that's super effective at it machine gun role, with the suppression area being so big it can sometimes suppress squads it shouldnt. Like, if 2 allies squad stand on either side of a luftwaffe bunker, an Mg birst can suppress the squad that's way outside its arc of fire, even standing behind the mg. 

The stummel is very good, the flakvierling truck for dak also it, and you get the upgraded 250 armored car which can quickly get out of hand.

Horrendous pathing affects everyone.

The US mortar isn't mortar beam accurate. that's the wespe.

The zook squad doesn't instantly removed the mg from combat, it forces it to move and suffer a bit of damage. It's more expensive than a simple smoke.

The allied halfytrack ? do you even know what you're saying ? The anti tank halftrack from the USF gets a slow barrage, but no formula 1 ability. That's for the quad, at most.

Vetrancy for the anti tank halftrack is a first shot bonus or a turret blocking shot.

USF and UK need to build a building before being able to produce mainline infantry and vehicles, unlike dak. T1 gives them access to assault grens, jaegers, mg34..

Chafee doesn't win  alone half the time against pz3.

Marders are good. Bike is good. radio truck is good, ambulance is goo and gives insane bonuses at vet1. leig is good. pz3 is greaat with upgrades, and tiger is downright insane.

With the new changes, the first plane gets shot down after the first strafe. The second one after the second/third. So yes, it doesn't finish after one strafe. I explained the diff between the strafes earlier in my post it isn't all that black and white but I do admit the stukas are generally better but at least they can be shot down unlike the allied heavy bombers.

That is an interesting take with the MG diff, but if there is an actual blob in one place it will still be pinned by any MG and the MG42 and 34 are both easily displaced while the .30cal is very difficult to kill and results in more braindead plays where the USF player will pull it up with their blob and setup under fire and there isn't much you can do about it because you just can't kill it fast enough in the early game. Just to clear things up, when I say blob I don't mean every unit in one spot. There can be two blobs for example and the situation becomes extremely difficult to handle because as I said, the MGs are easily displaced or avoided with the multitude of readily available indirects, call ins, spotting or smoke the allies get.

The US mortar is indeed laser beam accurate, feel free to check the scatter values as I mentioned above.

Yes, a super early and cheap AT unit that gets the ability to displace team weapons from range, totally fine. And I disagree as to your point since a decent player will use this ability when their attack goes in so the mg won't have the chance to setup after being forced to move, especially considering the fact, that the blocking of vision means you need to move a fair bit back to get a sensible field of fire.

I didn't say it gets any F1 ability, that's just how it's base mobility is without any abilities. Much much better than a marder for example. So yes, I do know what I'm saying. Before you get all worked up about it, yes it was an exaggeration but the point is it has way better mobility and utility than a higher tier unit for axis and if it wasn't for the diff in damage and pen it would be straight up better than the marder.

Yes, the difference being that you can afford this building straight away so you loose what? 30s on your first mainline... You build the insane sappers or some scouts anyways since you need them and DAK usually starts with the krad which also takes 30s to build so mainlines hit the field at the same time (wehr also requires T1) and trying to make a point of this diff is honestly just sad, cause there is no diff at all with the mainlines. But there is a diff in allies having access to mortars in T1 and that is a huge pain especially for DAK, cause they don't get any indirect for a long time. Also, T1 for DAK can't be built immediately and the diff is much larger than that 30s build time on allied T1.

Yeah... Half the time... For a unit that is way cheaper and available in an earlier tier... Just xd, the fact you say half the time and don't see anything wrong with that is crazy to me. Btw, before the latest chaffee nerfs it won with P3 most of the time but that was so unhinged they decided to change it xd.

Marders are ok, just as fragile as the USF HT but with worse mobility, so I'd say even more fragile in reality. Bike is an almost guaranteed loss. It's a unit you are forced to build just to be able to have some early map presence and is one of the reasons I would say that the cancer pathing we have affects DAK more than any other faction because they have a bunch of absolutely key vehicles that they NEED while other factions are more infantry based. Radio truck is decent I guess... doesn't fit every build order though and is pretty expensive for what it does. I'm pretty sure you think it's good because it's the only source of ISR for DAK and playing with a ton of vision against someone who was completely blind with a faction that relies on maneuver was almost like cheating so it does make a huge difference but it's more like giving DAK an ability that allies have all the time and from a bunch of different sources rather than being super good in and of itself. ambulance WAS really good but since it's a one shot now and it needs to be near the frontline to get xp and apply the bonus it isn't that fantastic, just a decent standard unit. Leig also WAS good but now it's just a standard mid tier howitzer. Indian mortar is way better and the usf mortar with the airburst also kinda better. Considering the cost and required tech I wouldn't call it a good unit kinda meh actually.Yes, Tiger is good but also easily counterable and extremely expensive and getting there against a decent player who is pressuring you usually doesn't happen. And yeah, finally the P3 xddd. If you are ahead massively it generally finishes the game, but so do stugs or carro's or most universal armor. The upgrades are super expensive and most of the time you don't have all of them but even with them it looses to a un upgraded sherman almost every time. Crusaders are a different story, they need to get in close if they aren't up gunned but they are so fast and the vet 1 ability they have is so strong that closing usually isn't a problem. The fact, that all the upgrades don't make the P3 at least equal to a sherman is just sad considering that they hit the field 30s apart.